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Eye of the Temple

Explore an vast and treacherous temple in room-scale VR · By runevision

New Build October 23, 2017

A topic by runevision created Oct 23, 2017 Views: 267 Replies: 20
Viewing posts 1 to 8
Developer (2 edits)

New build available October 23. (Read here how to sign up to get access.) Same download link you already got works for new build.

New additions:

  • The whip!
  • In-game menu where you can:
    • See how many gems you collected
    • Set platform movement smoothness
    • Set spectator camera mode
    • Start a speedrun
  • Various polish (water, nicer mountains in distance, better torch flame, ...)

See the video for more info!

Instructions:

  • Play area of 2.2 by 2.2 meters needed.
  • Unlike previous builds, both Vive controllers are needed now due to having both a torch and a whip.

Feedback

Reply to share your thoughts. All feedback welcome!

Whip feedback and discussion <- Let's keep this topic mostly in this thread.

Speedrun mode feedback and discussion <- Let's keep this topic mostly in this thread.

Anything else - just reply here!

My first time playing -- thanks for the opportunity!

Didn't try spectator mode, as I am only one person. 

Overall: Very cool game, but gave me some motion sickness.

The game itself is sweet.  Environment is awesome.  I love how you use roomscale to avoid the entire locomotion & chaperone issue.  This creates a huge sense of immersion.  In one of those really thin (1-block wide) corridors with the spike pit beneath, I felt like I was really there!  Also, one time I tried to adjust the brim of my hat.  You've nailed the immersion / atmosphere IMO.

At first I didn't know what to do with those flying scarab beetles and so it took me 2 tries to kill them.  I figured it out, though.

I get motion-sick pretty easy in VR (I usually use teleport locomotion) and I did have to stop playing after an hour or so.  [how long I lasted: I had opened the first dual-lock door to get inside the large temple, and then got to that large room with the second dual-look door, with puzzle rooms off to either side, where you complete the puzzle and come back out over the top.  I had done one of those side rooms-- the puzzle where that chess-piece style guy is chasing you around on blocks -- which was pretty fun, btw--and then got back to the main room, and had to quit due to motion sickness.]. 

Anyway, motion while turning or looking to the sides is what usually does me in with VR games.  So, lots of cases here where  where you'd be on a moving platform, and then turning to look at the next moving or stationary platform as you came to a stop and jumped off.  I think that's what really messed me up.  I tried only looking forward while on moving platforms, until each platform had come to a complete stop, and that helped a little, but there's often not that much time to wait.   But, yeah.  All the turning with motion really shakes me up.  I did try both smooth and linear platform motion, I think I preferred smooth and would probably prefer smoother.

I'm not sure what my advice is for fixing the motion sickness issue--it will be interesting to hear if other people have the same issue.  I've seen other games obscure part of the FOV while in motion, maybe that would help.  Making more platforms where you walk directly off the front of the platform, rather than the side, would likely help,

I may go back and try to finish the game later, but I don't think I'll be able to get farther than that--my head is spinning and need to go lay down for the rest of the evening!

Thanks for the fun build! Overall, I enjoyed myself despite the motion sickness.

Developer

Thanks for playing and for the feedback!

I get motion-sick pretty easy in VR (I usually use teleport locomotion) and I did have to stop playing after an hour or so. (...)  I did try both smooth and linear platform motion, I think I preferred smooth and would probably prefer smoother.

That's interesting; it goes against conventional wisdom for how to avoid motion thickness. I can try to increase the maximum smoothness value of the slider so you can try turning it further up in the next build.

I've seen other games obscure part of the FOV while in motion, maybe that would help.  Making more platforms where you walk directly off the front of the platform, rather than the side, would likely help.
Unfortunately the stepping off platforms to the side is quite important to be able to keep traversing and still stay within the play space, so I don't think I can change that. I tried reducing the FOV earlier in development and it felt weird to me, but I can give it another shot.
I may go back and try to finish the game later, but I don't think I'll be able to get farther than that--my head is spinning and need to go lay down for the rest of the evening!

The game saves your progress so I recommend playing in shorter sessions. :) If you keep it shorter, the feeling might not linger as much - let me know how it goes!

First launch had an error.
  Data Folder not found. There should be 'EyeOfTheTemple_WhipPuzzle_Data' folder next to the executable
This was fixed by renaming EyeOfTheTemple_Data folder to the expected name.

Using Oculus Touch, the whip was push down stick and menu button was B, so it worked fine. I suggest an option for switching hands since you can't swap which controller is held when it comes to the touch.

I've recorded my first 17 minutes of game play, currently as an unlisted youtube video here

Developer

Thanks for playing and for the feedback! The video is super helpful to see exactly what you're experiencing.

First launch had an error.
  Data Folder not found. There should be 'EyeOfTheTemple_WhipPuzzle_Data' folder next to the executable
Oops, my mistake, I uploaded a new zip file where this is fixed so others don't have to deal with it.
Using Oculus Touch, the whip was push down stick and menu button was B, so it worked fine. I suggest an option for switching hands since you can't swap which controller is held when it comes to the touch.

Good suggestion! I'll add that.

I'm happy (and a little surprised honestly) to hear that it just worked apart from that, when I never tested on the Rift. :) It seems like you have a solid 360 degree room scale tracking setup.

I saw in the video there was a moving platforms where the gems didn't materialize for you. That's weird and definitely not on purpose. I've made a note to investigate it.

It sounded like you wanted the glowy orbs that signify where the gems will appear to be more visible? Do the gems themselves need to be more visible too or are those okay?

You found a bug where the "danger" platforms can reset back to the beginning if you step off and on again at the end. Sorry about that, I'll get it fixed!

Feel free to make the video public if you like. Also, I lifted the restriction about not showing the game past a certain point, just FYI.

It sounded like you wanted the glowy orbs that signify where the gems will appear to be more visible? Do the gems themselves need to be more visible too or are those okay?

In the sunlight the glowy orbs were hard to see and some were hidden by some sort of bug with the water, in the dark they were easier to see though. The gems themselves seemed fine to me.

Also in the video I suggested some sort of small audio to know when you get on a new platform, that I think your pyramid game had (maybe add an option to enable/disable as well).

The beetle fight confused me because I didn't know if my attacks actually did anything or if I simply needed to go away and they automatically died.  I tried hitting and even trying to grab them with the whip but it only seemed to push them back, and the torch did very little as well. I'm not sure what to suggest as I don't know the proper way it was meant to be done. If they had some sort of health then maybe have them glow and dim or start flashing as they lose health and near death.

I'm glad you found the video helpful. I'll try to record whenever I play, but I have only played once so far and don't know if progress is saved at all. I've recorded it by actually just doing an unlisted livestream to youtube since I don't have a lot of storage space. Because its a livestream it could end up a very long video that might be a bit much to watch through, so I'll try to split it into parts if I do play a long session.

Developer
In the sunlight the glowy orbs were hard to see and some were hidden by some sort of bug with the water, in the dark they were easier to see  though. The gems themselves seemed fine to me.

All right, I'll think about making the orbs more visible in bright environments.

Also in the video I suggested some sort of small audio to know when you get on a new platform, that I think your pyramid game had (maybe add an option to enable/disable as well).

Right, I see what you mean. I opted not to have it to make the feel less arcadey and more immersive. I assume you'd like it to make it more clear whether the game registered you stepping onto a new platform or not?

If they had some sort of health then maybe have them glow and dim or start flashing as they lose health and near death.

Thanks for the suggestions! I'll figure something out to make it more clear when they take damage and are low on health.

I found a moment in my recording that perfectly shows a point where the orbs were hard to see IMAGE

I assume you'd like it to make it more clear whether the game registered you stepping onto a new platform or not?

Exactly, I'm not sure if a volume slider is a good idea for the sound, but a least a toggle would be nice.

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>That's interesting; it goes against conventional wisdom for how to avoid motion thickness. I can try to increase the maximum smoothness value of the slider so you can try turning it further up in the next build.

Hmm, I may be wrong-it did seem to be a problem for me on both ends of the spectrum.  I guess my thinking is that if the platform is moving quite a bit slower when i'm getting off, it would be less of a problem.  But I can try more of the "linear" side with a fresh mind and see if it helps.

>The game saves your progress so I recommend playing in shorter sessions. :) If you keep it shorter, the feeling might not linger as much - let me know how it goes!

Oh, good! Will do--thanks!

>It sounded like you wanted the glowy orbs that signify where the gems will appear to be more visible? Do the gems themselves need to be more visible too or are those okay?

FWIW, I always found myself looking down, to see platforms, and so I missed a lot of gems this way.

This was also my first time playing the game, and it was great!

I actually did record a 30 minute video, but for some reason, as soon as I lit the torch and entered the game, the mic cut out on obs. I don't know if that's my problem or yours, but I guess you can look into that. (I just checked obs while writing the message, and it seems the mic isn't picking up anything, so  I think its my problem actually) Anyway, if I can remember my reactions, here they are:

The whip: the physics were a little float-y, but if we were in a world with a little less gravity, I think that the graphics would be perfect. I think that's what I actually said while recording. It was great, but I think I was struggling a bit trying to grab the lever correctly with the whip. I think I was just pretty bad at aiming, probably not your fault.

In-game menu: during the recording, I tried out all three modes for a bit, and *pauses writing to review footage* okay, I have realized that I am bad with recording on obs. The whole time I was in third person, I.... to keep some of my integrity I will not continue that sentence. Though what I did see of it, it seemed like it followed me pretty well. 

   The smoother, but still first person thing was basically what you said it would do. And that's what it did. then the mirror was the mirror, not much about that either.

   I did like how it showed gems you've collected, but maybe you can just put that on the torch if you get rid of the menu in the final game, or maybe just put it on both for now and gauge people's reactions. I don't know i'm not good at those types of things. 

   With the smooth and sharp platform transitions I think I just like putting it on maximum smoothness, its more natural, because that's how things work in real life,slow at first, speed up, then slow down toward the end. it was also nice to have the buttons at the bottom easily accessible.

Though, with Jay's complaint about seeing the orbs, I didn't have that. I could see them perfectly fine. Maybe it's an oculus thing...idk. If I have anything else I want to say, I will say something. Hope this helps!

Developer

Thanks for trying it out, and for the feedback!

To try to get some extra discussion going, let me try to ask a blunt question:

What would you pay for the game (if anything) if it was released like it is now?

And what kind of improvements could make it worth 5$ more than that?

(1 edit)

I think that in its current state, it would be worth somewhere between $5-10

It has good content that lasts for a bit, but if you had 5 bucks more? Maybe have a multiplayer racing mode, multiple levels, make textures a little more high definition, and maybe add a level creator. all that might actually be more like a $15-20 game

Don't take it only from me though, I usually don't buy games more than $10, so I'm kinda cheap. Get some other people's thoughts, too.

Oh, and sorry for replying so slow, I was playing Rec Room.

Tried this out today. Really liking the extra addition! Feel more like Indiana Jones with a whip in your hand :-)

Noticed that the torch doesn't hit the lever all the time, just passes through it sometimes. I think the whip doesn't crack unless it hits something? I could be wrong but that's how it appeared, as I couldn't seem to crack it in the air like a real whip would. 

Liking the water & the background scenery. Adds a bit of a wow factor when you overlook the valley of mountains after the room of pillars. Speaking of the pillar rooms, I surprised myself by beating both rooms without being knocked off once, when I played the very first build it took me at least 10-15 goes. If I remember correctly, the routes you have to take seemed very similar in both rooms. Maybe that could be changed up a bit?

The flying bugs surprised me, wasn't expecting them! Like others have said, some indication that you're actually doing damage would be good. Some other creatures/animals would be great, but I'm sure you'll be working on that already.

Some of the gems were clipping into the corners of some walls, I think in the same places where I spotted them from the first build where they were introduced.

Thought the added music, swinging blades and fire were a great addition too. The flames particularly were awesome, almost felt the heat from them :-)

I didn't attempt a speedrun, as I think it just wouldn't be safe for me in my minimum playspace and with the Vive cable. I almost ripped the cable out of the link box a few times when I was just taking my time :-| Can't wait for wireless VR to be the norm, as my cable gets tangled like crazy.

Noticed you'd not changed anything on the top of the temple. Do you have any plans for that part? I just spent the whole time travelling across the top just playing with the whip some more.

I think that's all for now, if I remember anything else I'll let you know.

Developer

Thanks for trying it out and for the feedback and suggestions!

I think the whip doesn't crack unless it hits something?

I know. :( I spent so long trying to make this work but ultimately didn't succeed yet. All the approaches I tried either made it too hard to create the crack, or made it happen too often at times that didn't seem correct. There are still a few more ideas I can try though.

(1 edit) (+1)

Just did a play-through! I have to say, this is turning into a must-play title for me, I'm very impressed with the direction you've taken this. I recorded my run, it's just about an hour, available here (obviously with spoilers) with possible points of interesting marked in the description. I'll try to summarize my thoughts...

1. Torch, very enjoyable, it is so nice to have a personal light source, it helps a lot with transporting me, especially when I can make shadows play. Also really nice that the burning noise increases with flailing of the torch.
2. The rolls are new to me, that is so clever, I love that the distance we move back is physically correct! And they work just fine, not at all as disruptive as the old rotating things. These worked really well, but I also had the floor center marker visible so that might have helped. I'm pondering if showing a wire-frame floor grid could be a comfort option... ?
3. The gauntlet corridors, those are super nice. I'm not sure if it only was the surprise factor, but they had me in giggles and panic in equal shares, good stuff :) I both got excited and slightly wary whenever that drum beat would start :D (I noticed the beams in the video, I didn't realize it at the time, but they do create a static reference while looking at the stuff to avoid, that's really clever!)
4. I quite miss any sounds for the floating gem-inserters, I know this is WIP but figured I should just comment on it, as it sticks out.
5. Collecting gems is nice, it spreads my attention and generates plenty of confused whipping of arms and falling accidents. They seem a bit weird after respawning though, I'm not sure if I'm just not seeing them, or if they only spawn after I have reached where I died or something. I would go from the checkpoint and forward, just to turn around and see the glows behind me. I would kind of expect for a gem to stay after I've once spawned it, with the whip it would be possible to pick them up from a slight distance which is impossible when they fade back out.
6. The boss rooms, I never finished that last time I tried this, now I actually completed the whole thing :) Very nice. It took some pre-planning and observation, which is a nice change of pace from frantically jumping between platforms, which is what we do after planning ;) Quite enjoyable, and surprisingly tense for being such a slow moving danger! :O
7. I love the art direction, with the environment and sounds and effects. It's all very coherent and fits well together, I like it :)

I'm actually kind of exhausted now, and I need to eat something, my mind is blanking out xD More thoughts in the video if you want them ;) Cheers!

Developer

Got time now for watching the video. Thanks a lot for playing and recording. Recorded video with talking out loud is the ideal way for me to fully understand the feedback (and is just enjoyable to watch too!).

Nice work on the follow-cam by the way, if I didn't say it already!

I'm pondering if showing a wire-frame floor grid could be a comfort option... ?

It's an interesting idea. If you could try the rollers without your floor center marker and let me know if that's worse or the same, it would help me to better know if it really does help or not.

I quite miss any sounds for the floating gem-inserters, I know this is WIP but figured I should just comment on it, as it sticks out.

Yep, it's on my todo-list. Fine to comment on it though, there's always the chance there's stuff I've overlooked.

The gems seem a bit weird after respawning though, I'm not sure if I'm just not seeing them, or if they only spawn after I have reached where I died or something.

Yeah, there's definitely a bug there I need to investigate. Sorry about the confusion!

I would kind of expect for a gem to stay after I've once spawned it, with the whip it would be possible to pick them up from a slight distance which is impossible when they fade back out.
The gems disappear when you step off the platform that made them appear. The design reason is that there are some platforms that cross paths, and it doesn't feel nice and neat when you can collect (and get confused by) gems that "belong" to another platform and which mess up the simple gem trails. You can collect gems from a distance with the whip (as you noticed) as long as you don't step off the platform. All the uncollected gems you noticed "post-mortem" were mostly due to a bug and hopefully should not be as much of an issue once that is fixed.
Developer

By the way, you mentioned the oddity of the Vive controller triggers not being used. The reason is that people tend to frequently press the triggers involuntarily when swinging the whip. Same with the grip buttons. Apart from the application menu button, the trackpad seemed least likely to be pressed accidentally.

Impressions of first play: Started up right away, no problems (Vive, Steam beta, just running the .exe). Tried lighting the "start game" thing with the torch. Intuitive, worked right away, sweet.  Saw two footprints on the ground, "stand here"? Ok, worked, nice. Now in real game.

Nice scenery, graphics looks good, polished. The whip is great! Fun to just play around with. I acctually understand why someone who was afraid of snakes had some problems with it, it does feel a little bit "snaky" :) Tried to make it crack in the air, couldn't, slightly disappointing. Then noticed it seems to crack kinda randomly when hitting surfaces.

Next step: into the platforms. Immediate jarring feeling as you suddenly start moving without really moving when before you were in complete control. I'm sensitive to motion sickness (and also semi-old, 37). Have had VR since DK2 but never really gotten used to beging moved around. So not sure how many people this applies to, but for me it's a huge problem. Would have uninstalled and never played again if it wasn't for testing. Ok, braced and moved on to next platform. Leaned forward this time, like snowboarding, anticipating the movement. Still jarring, but a little bit better.

Next step: platform that you have to step off at the end. First time I didn't step off and was surprised when getting moved backwards again (unlike the first platforms). Almost stopped playing once more.

Next step: Roller that you have to walk backwards to stay on. Tried one, started feeling naseous, got across, exited the game.

Ok so sorry for the negativity, but this was the reality for me. I hope it's not for many others! One of the most motion sickness inducing games I've tried, the other being some platform jumper for Oculus. It's sad, because I really think the idea of staying in your chaperone bounds and moving between platforms is a genius idea. Alot of other things also seem really polished and well done. Some other thoughts: I think motion sickness induction can be graded a little bit like this (at least for me):

1: Movement is 1-1 real movement - very little motion sickness. For instance Holopoint.

2: Movement is 1-1 but also with teleportation - very little motion sickness. Vanishing Realms, The Lab.

3: Movement is not 1-1, but you control the movement directly via input - some motion sickness.

4: Movement is not controlled by you but anticipated - quite alot of motion sickness.

5: Movement is not controlled by you and not anticipated - lots of motion sickness.

So Eye of the Temple hit level 5 for me, and might go down to level 4 with some more playtime, but might go up to level 5 again in new areas.

I don't see any good way to solve this without changing the core gameplay (atleast the part I saw), so the correct strategy is probably to ignore people with high motion sickness and just go for the rest of the demographic.

Will give it one more try later, but probably wont get much further.  Hope this input was of some help though!

Developer

Hi Erik, Thanks for trying it out!

While many people say they get little or no motion sickness with this game compared to many other games, some still do, and you're not the only one in that regard. It's very individual.

If you do give it another try, try to bring up the application menu (the one shown in the video) and bring the slider all the way to the left (Sharp) and see if that perhaps makes it a little bit better. I'm not sure it will, but it's worth a try if you're loading up the game again anyway. You could also try other slider values. I'd be very interested in hearing if it makes any difference for you.

Hello again! Gave it another spin, tried the sharpness option as you suggested. 100% sharp does feel a little bit better, combined with having played it once before I made it to the first lever this time. (Also tried 100% smooth, definitely worse imo but the difference is not very big - maybe 15% decrease/increase in motion sickness for me). Walking backwards on the rollers was still pretty hard motion-sickness-vise.

Nice touch that you can move the lever with the torch and the handle of the whip in addition to sticking the whip. Sticking was kind of hard at first, got easier.

Developer

Thanks for trying it again Erik. Good to hear the sharpness option makes it a little better, though I do understand it's only a minor difference.

The game saves your progress so theoretically you might be able to play it at small increments at a time, but realistically with the degree of motion sickness you experience I imagine it's probably still not practical or comfortable enough.