Indie game storeFree gamesFun gamesHorror games
Game developmentAssetsComics
SalesBundles
Jobs

Don't get discouraged

A topic by ItAllStartsWithYou created Dec 07, 2018 Views: 553 Replies: 11
Viewing posts 1 to 8
(+7)

So since this contest started I have been watching twitch streams about it and looking at the reviews and I personally have played a good number of these games, and I just had a message I wanted to share with everyone in this contest - Don't get down. It's only been a handful of days but I have see a lot of hate from others directed at others. Sometimes we don't stop and think before we speak. We stream a game, tear it apart and then rush to our computer to demoralize and spread our "I know better because I have so and so followers" Now I'm not trying to attack any one person, but I saw one gamer get thrashed and turn to "Fine, I'll never make another game again." And we act  like..."Get over it." Don't let this competition turn to hate. It's good to be critical to help someone... but make sure your comments are coming from a good place. Because I don't know how things like "Your story sucks. You used the based materials so obviously your game isn't good. Your art came from a pack so its not good. Your plugins aren't original so your game is bad." These are opinions. If any one of us was a solo artist, programmer, writer, whatever... we wouldn't really be an indie developer would we. We each have strengths and are using games to showcase what we can do. And before anyone gets on their high horse, there isn't one game in this competition that is perfect. There also isn't one game everyone is going to like. Just because someone tears you down, doesn't mean your game isn't good. Aside from someone pointing out an actual bug or crash, so much of these comments are OPINION based. Please remember that. And hopefully comments will be critical and help you grow instead of tearing you down, but as artists we must accept hate comes with this line of work. Yeah we got to deal with them. I can preach all day about others being kinder, but it starts with you as a developer to say even if I get hate, that isn't a reflection on me... so to the guy or girl... who said they would stop making games, please don't. I played your game. It has so much potential. I And I will tell you this, I looked at the entries and I played your game early on an it was the one I said man that's going to win. This is a great game. Yes, my opinion. The game engine you used was unique to me. I didn't know your assets or art or some  plugins were apparently what everyone uses. But you know it didn't matter. Think about this, you still managed to gain a fan even with those base assets. A game that can do that without throwing custom sparkly stuff at you, that has something. Now I know this is the part where someone is going to say "So you're saying people who customized everything aren't good", well you're obviously missing my point. As developers, we miss the actual game. We miss the message when all we can focus on is... omg they're using moghunter or yanfly plugins everywhere. Or omg they are using all the base assets that come  with SRPG Studio - cause you know unless you're a game dev, you won't know that. If you don't believe me, go play a game from an engine you know nothing about - you wouldn't be able to tell me what comes with it or doesn't. So you don't let those facts that you know the art or you know the plugins or music to say well they had a whole month and they should have made everything original - and that taints a true playthrough. I know the people that do this won't change. It's hate. It's competition.  Hey, I hold props to the people in this competition who go out there play the games and say I'm going to give everyone a fair shake. Good on you. But  I know the hate won't stop... but I hope the people who entered this contest can change their perception of some of it. There are no bad games here. All I see is a shit ton of potential. There are things that aren't my cup of tea, but that doesn't mean it isn't good. Don't let the non constructive criticism get to you. You are all indie, you are all growing. And each and every one of you is capable of greatness - don't let the haters dictate your worth or your games worth. At the end of the day one game might have thousands of ratings. You might have 4. Who's to say the former game is better? Only you can say that. Reframe your perception. Some of the greatest most touching games to me were not popular. Some of the games I  go back to and thought man I didn't just enjoy playing this but it touched me. It moved me. Those games weren't popular. Don't let your followers or lack of followers dictate what is good. You keep making your games. You do it for you and if you made something you are proud of, you already won. Yeah yeah the hates are going to say yeah you can make something you like but this is a competition or can you actually make money doing it. or if it doesn't sell well then why are you wasting time making anything. Let them say it. Let them spew hate. Because they want you to stop. Then  they win. Don't stop. Don't let societies view on success dictate your views. One of the greatest franchises today I love - its a tv show - but was Veronica Mars. They cancelled that show years ago. They said it was awful. No one watched it when it originally ran. Then people started to see it on youtube. It slowly built a following and fans who originally weren't demanded it come back. Netflix finally listened to that and brought it back. But people originally bashed that show. It had more haters than fans. But that fact did not mean it wasn't good. If one person only plays your game, but you impact that person for life. Isn't that better than a thousand followers? Maybe not money wise, but then you got to ask yourself why are you making games? If it's because you say because I couldn't do anything else and be happy... then screw what haters say and you keep doing your thing because as long as you keep working and trying hard and you are making something you are proud of, you'll succeed. If its just to make money, well then go ahead and listen to what the people want, but you're going to find it a hard time to try and make everyone happy. 

Ok ok enough of this rant... and for anyone that got to the end of this... good on you. Don't give up guys. I like these competitions because you can see how much talent is truly out there. You guys made part of a game in less than a month! Be proud of that. Truly few  people can accomplish that!

(+3)

Great message for any budding gamedev out there. In this ruthless industry we all need some reassuring sometimes. You should never give up if you truly believe in your project

However, I have to offer a more balanced view in the subject (in my opinion). People always have high expectations and tend to more easily view the flaws on content they didnt make, ignoring the effort and the good behind the superficial, but this does not always mean they are haters. Harsh criticism is something any creator needs to be able to take, no matter how scathing it is. We need to see it, process it, learn from it and move on. Blind faith in the goodness of your project is also a bad thing

Keep working on your games. You will get better the more you try. Don't let yourself be dragged down by negativity, but don't fully ignore it. It will make you stronger each time, until you finally get recognized for your passionate work

Very very true. Not all are haters. You make very valid points. :) and any constructive criticism that makes you grow is definitely a good thing. 

(+4)

I'm impressed with anyone that finishes something. Literally no matter what you did good.

(+1)

as far as i know, in game making bussiness getting insulted in 1000000000 times much better than getting ignored

(+1)

I've made games since two years ago. My first game never got a good review, no one gave it a chance, but when I played it again, on my own, months later, I enjoyed my game I made. It was hilarious. The story I wrote was genius to me.  Everything I thought about and wanted to show came alive when I played that game again.  Not a single review on that game, but I didn't care. I loved making games. It was my passion. 

Then the second game I made had great reviews! It made me want to be a game developer more!

Then the third came around, which is in this competition and so far, I don't have a lot of reviews. Not a lot of people are giving my game a chance but its ok. I develop games because I love it! And I do it with the purpose of making that one person life change. 

So don't get too discourage. Grab a bucket of popcorn and watch those bad reviews because those are worth gold! They are literally telling you how to improve your game. When you are off in the bigger world, no one will tell you why your game isn't great. Make the mistakes early on now so when you do become big, it won't happen again. :)

Oh, the first game I made was called second chance.

You really have to love it, and I do. Making games for awards and notoriety won't usually work out very well in the long run. The process of putting together a fun, balanced and interesting game gives me a great feeling. My game hasn't gotten a ton of votes so far either, but any type of 'popularity' based thing can be rather fickle, i've found.

Yeah, I have made a game every weekend for about 4 months now I believe.  Some are better than others but it is fun coming up with an idea and seeing how close your finished product meets that vision.  You must know your limits but also aim to try something different, cause otherwise you are not learning anything.  Passion in a project definitely shows.

(1 edit)

*laugh from the twitch distance*

Yeah sure but if your game has bad design choices I have no reason not to say "yo, the passability in this map is BULLCRAP WTF FIX IT" or "having 100  scripts means nothing if they're all tacked on with no thought put on it", "yo these map transfers suck", "yo the text is not readable" or "using custom/purchased   resources does not hide the fact that this is badly made".  A regular player can tell you what they like and not, but dev criticism (while obviously has bias) can help pinpoint super easy stuff to fix if only you know the framework. 

Also I'll keep shouting "WHAT DID YOU EXPECT? It's a freaking JUDGED CONTEST WITH PRIZE MONEY". Good on you if you're happy showing off a crappy first project but when placed next to a polished product on a scale you can't expect the same response. (And besides, it's not in anyone's job description or streaming cred to prop you up particularly, they're usually there to entertain an audience if at all.) Besides, obviously streamers don't think to much about what they're saying. It's a STREAM OF CONSCIOUSNESS sort of media. 

Srsly, don't give up and all that, but don't try to push the idea that everyone needs to be babied about feedback IN A BLOODY CONTEST.

Tl;dr do your thing and don't give up, but understand people don't owe you anything and a contest environment has a competitive and harsher edge. If you don't feel you can handle that, don't start from there. There are other much friendlier places where an early game can be seen more kindly. 

(1 edit) (+2)

That's not what ItAllStartsWithYou is saying. He said to listen to the useful criticism and not focus on the overly negative. As for it being a judged contest that is irrelevant. Judging can be fair and critical without being overly harsh. Just look at your comments in your thread on rpg maker, you gave SmashArtist suggestions on improving his game.

There are shows which have harsh judges and shows which don't. Both can survive.

I made 15-16 games that use Thai language and share in my country. 

I use to expected so much about comment but they give nothing, although my games are free download. 

Now I don't  care anymore, I just make and make game to fulfill  my need. Because I want to play my games. 

(+1)

One of the aspects that are looked in people for in the game industry, is for them to have a public game. It doesn´t matter if it´s good or bad. Just look at how many people said they would join and only about 21% made it.  When it comes to engament, it´s better to have negative than nothing. Because now you know someone actually got interested in what you did and you can learn from it.