What happens next time when credit card companies say they won't take payment from websites that sell games with gay characters? Or games with violence? Or games with any cursing? If you cave in at the first sign of pressure, you're opening the door for something even worse in the future. Itch bowing down without putting up any fight, even going so far as to remove non-NSFW games that just featured gay people is a disgrace and they absolutely are at fault.
What irks me is that they say it's about this game called "No Mercy." I can understand if the game itself violated the TAC on the site where it was posted, but even then, Itch and Steam could have just delisted THAT GAME. This is an extreme overreaction and has shown that outside companies and interest groups can bully them into dictating what consumers can legally and consentually consume with their own money. Yes, it is the payment systems and those who manage them that are at fault here. However, to give in to the pressure like this without warning makes it feel like they are just giving up without a fight. Most of the games that were delisted didn't violate the Terms; you need an account even to download NSFW games, which requires age verification; and we, as consumers, can either just not buy the game or, if it does violate something, report it. These creators have Freedom of Speech, and consumers, adult consumers at that, have the right to make a legal and informed purchase.
I can agree with that: Itch is a victim, maybe not a martyr... but still a victim.
My enemy is all what allows to payment providers to choke our rights.
Even if we abandon itch, the same can happen anywhere else, and in future not only to games.
So we don't have to fight among us, but rather against our real enemies
I disagree. Itch could have told Visa (or whoever else) to go pound sand and found a new payment processor. Paypal, Stripe, Venmo, Cashapp. Hell a crypto payment processor like CoinGate?
Taking down the game was a betrayal of their community. The whole purpose of Itch is to support indie devs. They let big brother stomp on one of their own.
They then went above and beyond that and basically shadowbanned their entire NSFW collection of games. That's not just bad, that's twirl-your-mustache villainous.
Dude the fact they nuke all nfsw games it's enough to question the platform and even get angry. Yes, I understand they were pressured by paid platforms, but not even Steam did what itch.io did. They nuke all games Without thinking twice.
It's as if they took the easy way out, instead of reviewing the NFSW games on the platform. And if that's the case, it means that the tedious reviews that NFSW games go through before they're released have been useless all this time.
"They're just hidden while they're reviewing games"that's exactly what I mean with nuke. I know that most games are still here. But the fact But the fact that they were all hidden is questionable at best. Do previous itch.io reviews hold no weight? Were all the NFSW games previously reviewed by itch.io allowed without proper authorization? or itch.io just took the easy way out and hide/nuke all games (That's not counting the games that were permanently removed.).
Well, first of all, hiding content is a very detached concept from "nuking" it.
Second, this situation is more complicated than that. With the pressure from payment processors, Itch needs to be more careful. Many of the games being targeted and removed are done so based on some of the fetishes associated with them. This is due to Collective Shout, a puritan group that has been influencing payment processors to disallow content they disagree with from being sold.
I would assume that NSFW games being hidden is being done in order to protect themselves and developers while they sort everything out with said payment providers.
First, dude you're really arguing about the definition of nuke? i hope you know that the term "nuke" real definition is different from what you and i are using it. and the way you and i use it is more in line with the "urban" use of it.
second, my point still stand. Are you consciously or subconsciously ignoring the fact that Steam went through the same pressure and didn't decide to "nuke" all adult games?
Again, is incredible to think that the previus itch.io system of reviewing games don't have any weight, and they have to resort to hiding/nuke all the nfsw games.
I am arguing against the use of the word. When people hear about something getting "nuked", they assume people mean that it got deleted, which is not the case here. The clarification is important to avoid blatant misinformation. The literal definition does not matter.
Your insistence to use the word feels like a rhetoric intentionally for the purpose of antagonizing Itch.
Itch and Steam are not the same. Steam is owned by Valve. Itch is indie. There are plenty of ways this could change how each handles moderation. Truthfully, I don't know how they function, but I don't expect that you do either. If I am correct to expect that, I believe it is unreasonable to criticize Itch for a situation you do not understand. Moreover, I feel like your frustrations are misplaced and that they should be directed toward those that have forced this decision to be made in the first place.
With all that said I'm done. This has been a headache.
First, you don't decide how I speak/express myself. If there's any confusion with what I say, I'm willing to explain myself. Now again, this isn't the same as you telling me how I speak, especially when my way of speaking is valid (it's incredible that you're ignoring the actual definition of nuke to maintain your narrative).
Second, based on your second paragraph, it seems you have no idea how itch.io moderation works. I have a surprise for you. I do have an idea, because I'm a developer of NSFW games on this platform, and every game that enters itch.io goes through a review before being indexed.
Every NSFW developer who wants to publish a game here has to follow a number of strict rules before appearing in searches. And even then, they have to promote their game independently because itch.io doesn't offer much support for small developers.
So, after all those reviews, to find that itch.io decided to hide all the NFSW games without taking into account all the rules they previously established is at least questionable.
Dude, it's incredible that you're so confident about something without any information on the subject.
If itch.io was on our side, then they would give clear directions to everyone on the site how to fight this. I.e. which petitions to sign, who to contact, how to get our voices heard. Did we get that? No. We got a spineless response that they're "cleaning up shop" (i.e. throwing the baby out with the bathwater).
So is itch the good guys? Are they on our side? No. We got a single emoji announcement from them on discord. Well I've got one for you too, itch.
I think we've lost sight of how we can fight back. Here are the links to the petitions. PLEASE SIGN!
Tell MasterCard, Visa & Activist Groups: Stop Controlling What We Can Watch, Read, or Play https://chng.it/b2pMbsLvdg
Mastercard: Sex work is work. End your unjust policy https://action.aclu.org/petition/mastercard-sex-work-work-end-your-unjust-policy
UK: The scope of the Online Safety act is far broader & restrictive than is necessary in a free society. https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/722903
The reason phone call complaints are effective with these payment processor companies is because it takes up valuable time that the company could be otherwise dealing with other issues. Phone support is expensive and slow, which makes it an ideal pressure point A large public outcry is what causes companies to pay attention and consider backtracking.
Make a script about why this is bad (payment processor companies shouldn't be censoring legal material because they personally think it's immoral and it's an attack on free speech - you can ask AI to create a script for you if you don't have to time to write a long message) then call VISA/MasterCard/STRIPE/Paypal, you'll be on hold for a while because everyone is calling, and say you'd like to lodge a complaint. Then when they ask what this is in regards to, just start reading your script. The longer the better since that's the point. We essentially have to keep this up for the next few weeks if we want something to happen. We don’t need to be aggressive - just persistent. Keep the pressure on and call every few days, or every day if you care about this issue.
The following link has all the contact information you need to call them:
Service reps will now try to quickly escort you to "e-mailing" instead once they realize you're complaining about itch and Steam's recent censorship - try to just keep them on the line. In one call when they attempted to do this, I simply asked, "Are phone call complaints reported to your company or not?" and they just kept repeating "You must e-mail _________" - I was like, "You're not answering my questions, do you report them or not?" and eventually they transferred me to a supervisor who was really awesome to talk to and spent a long time talking to me.. Asking them about why companies are attempting to ban legal content is also a good question that they can't answer but will keep them on the line for a while.
Itch is mostly to blame. They bent the knee. There's are multiple ways around things. It takes time, yes. However, they could have easily said that they were looking into alternatives and would not delist games. Now, not only are they losing game developers and customers but people won't trust them again. Even if people find it annoying to host on another site, they will do it. Itch isn't like Steam. There are plenty of other sites people can host their games. The payment processors will back track eventually. It has nothing to do with the type of games. It's the censorship. If people think they are going to stop at NSFW games, they are wrong. It's already going past that. Visa and Steam has already been bombarded by calls and emails so much that their support staff is overwhelmed. When things do get backtracked, it won't matter for Itch. The damage is done. Steam will be fine. Itch won't recover. Hope it was worth it.
Don't blame this on "Payment provider"/"Payment Facilitator, simply get a new PF if the current PF creates problems. Mastercard and Visa are bad but as far as I know are only trying to enforce USA style "child porn" laws on foreign countries (yes they are that bad). MC and Visa have not banned adult contents, this is an issue with the current PF, see GBPP (Global Bran Protection Program or such), BRAM (Brand Recognition ...) programs by Visa/MV to see what MC and Visa officially currently accepts. What MC/Visa accepts if more or less -> local law - CP unless CP ban breaks local law (probably).
Finding a new PF should fix the issue, and there should be many PFs out there that do adult contents, especially contents not featuring actual real people like drawn images. I can try to see if I can find a PF to give ITCH a call but this situation is the fault of ITCH not finding an alternative PF, and mostly not the fault of MC/Visa.
That being said there is a lot of unofficial rules implemented by PFs but those should be possible to navigate by ITCH.
