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Those "Rate for rate"'s HAVE to go!

A topic by Nitai99 created Aug 09, 2020 Views: 334 Replies: 34
Viewing posts 1 to 12
Submitted (1 edit) (+4)(-2)

I remember the exact same thing happened a year ago in the GMTK jam 2019. We all scrambled to get some more feedback, to hear the same thing we have already heard multiple times one more time. To get one more rate. Trust me, it's not gonna lead us anywhere good. These rate for rates imply that we don't want to play each other's game and if fact, we don't. I have made a post ("Rating your games") and people reply to it all the time, asking for feedback and rates. So far I have rated about 30 games. I also asked, in that post, that people also give my game a look. 9 people rated my game. Now, I am ok with that, but if people, given the choice (it wasn't fully clear from my post if I demand a rate in return for my rating, and I in fact don't), don't want to play each other's game, then we have a really big problem as a community. It seems like we lost the ability to enjoy a game without knowing that the other person will also look at our creation.

So please think about it and stop making these endless rate for rates. In a week when the rating period ends it will all feel so stupid, so stop doing it now!

Submitted

I totally agree, I feel bad even posting mine to the 100s of topic threads haha. Even then I only go 3 ratings for the 10+ posts I submitted on.. If you're going to spam it, at least put the time in to enjoy the actual point of the jam!

I do like the themed rate for rates though, then it can be a mini curation of certain genres

Submitted (3 edits)

I genuinely want to play peoples games and see how they approached the theme, I even played your game before voting period started, you can see my thread here

I don't mind if people play and rate mine or not, it would be nice but I don't expect it. Having said that, there are plenty of times where people have said they have rated and my count has not moved for an hour and I'd prefer if people would stop being dishonest in an attempt to get me to rate their game, its clear I am playing every game in order regardless and would prefer if you didn't pretend to have spent the time playing mine when you really just see me as a (vote) number to exploit.

Just to be clear, I do not consider those who don't play and rate mine to be exploiting me because I want to play peoples games as I said, its the dishonesty for personal gain I consider to be exploitative.

Submitted
Deleted 4 years ago
Submitted

Make sure you post it in my thread! I can't keep up with sporadic comments in different areas so I've kept it in 1 area that I'm working through in order to be fair.

Submitted

Hi! 

I left a rate and a review in your page. Great job!

Check our game too~

Submitted

i agree with you

the count not changing at all when people say they rated  i think i got atleast 4 to 5 of such comments.

but i ignored it because they are many others who enjoyed playing my game. 

Submitted (1 edit)

Absolutely, they just make it harder to engage with those who actually played the game and see where you need to improve. It's also obvious they aren't even reading my thread because they would see that I don't care if they rate mine or not (it would be nice ofcourse, its the feedback that comes with it that I find valuable) so there is absolutely no reason to play me for a fool.

I've also actively avoided other peoples threads because  a lot of the early ones I looked at I could see its clearly a rate trade, 5 minute old thread and someone has played and rated 7 games...

Submitted

The problem is with most other threads. I also want to play games and like I said, I don't care too much if people don't play mine, I know I will get to 20 ratings some time soon and I don't really care beyond having that chance.

But I think with other threads, both the posters and the repliers are hurting themselves a lot.

Submitted(+1)

Yeah, I think it is a broken system but it is the only way to more people play your game. They should make the karma system better, for example as more "random" games you play clicking on that "take me to a random game" button, more chances of your game showing up to someone at the random section. Right now the karma system only shows up if you select at the filter(and that is bad, because when you open the page the default section is random). I am doing like crazy the rate for rate thing but I don't like it. I would love it if my game had the chance like any other. Because it's easy to be famous on youtube and then have a lot of rating on your game just because of this, there is a lot of hidden gems right at the bottom of the page with 10 or 5 rates and It's really hard to find them.

Submitted(+1)

The problem is not with asking for rates and feedback and spamming it everywhere. With so many games this is how we can easily advertise our so people can play . The problem comes when people fake their rates just so they get rated back.

Submitted

Exactly, every time I rate a game I leave it a really detailed comment with all my toughts on the game.

Some people ate only saying "rated". This looks like those small channel changing subscribers and the video are still with 0 viewers.

Submitted(+1)

i don't want anyone to rate without playing and i too don't wanna rate without playing

but we all need people to play our game. i cannot see how that happens.

it just benefiting when u are active and keep commenting and when u are not ur game gets pushed.

like at night i almost get 0 ratings...:/

but i have so much trust in my game that everyone who plays it will like it and i fell happy when a comment appears

Submitted

TRUE

I've do this for a day. but this post make me think again....

I've a fell rate for a while but all of comment before I've do "rate for rate" can desbribe what they like and what they need to tell me which is not OK, but after I did . My rate gone up to 19 but I think I don't get anything else.  Everyone have 12 more days to wait people found their game and play.  If it good, you'll be popular without doing anything cuz you are make an excellent game now....


thank to this threads.  It's reallize me about this <3

ps : sorry for bad Eng :/

Submitted (1 edit)

'If it good, you'll be popular without doing anything cuz you are make an excellent game now....'
Unfortunately that does not really seem to be how it works most of the time

Submitted(+1)

yes, there is a lot of good games that are not showing up because on the top are really mediocre games with a lot of ratings. Dani's game is really good but he is only on the top because he is famous, once I played one great game on random but he had only 7 ratings(and I think it should be on the most popular games).

Submitted

Every system I think of can be abused in some way with or without rate for rate as they all rely on fair ratings and honesty which I don't hold much hope on. My best idea is to have a cooldown between votes to stop the same person 'rating' 7 games in 5 minutes.

Submitted

It's also a good idea but then it would be kind of boring because some games are really short. Idk if you saw but I gave a solution too in my reply to the topic. Check it out.

Submitted (1 edit)

The problem with your solution is that if karma is just based on number of votes using the random filter then people will just spam 'random', vote whatever they feel like and the boost themselves to the top. 

That's what I mean when they all rely on fair play and honesty.

Submitted(+1)

yeah you are right, maybe if they combo both ideas and then add some feature that it counts the hours you played the game and can only rate after playing a certain amount of time. Maybe even the dev could define this amount of time

Submitted

If WebGL were suitable for everyones game then this would probably be the best solution, its not perfect and people can still leave games running in the background but at least it would slow it down

Submitted

Sure, maybe totally avoiding is impossible but is good that we are trying.

Submitted

Man...... Feel bad to hear that but it's a fact....

Submitted

This is my teams first game jam, and we are genuinely interested in how the jam works. Does anyone know how the number of ratings affect your games final rank? I know that a game needs more than 20 ratings to be eligible for winning, but other than that, is it better for your score if more people play your game or not? 

Submitted

I disagree. I get the sentiment of your frustration but the rate threads really help gauge the most active members in the community and the active members of the community are the people who's games I want to play. There's too many submissions to do it any other way, unless you plan on going one by one through the submission page playing all ~2000 submissions I don't know what else can be done. If you have a suggestion for a better system I'd love to hear it though.

Submitted

How are you deciding what makes those users active though?

Submitted(+1)

The karma system does exactly that.

Submitted

This ^

Submitted

But for some reason it is not the default sorting. I have no idea why they would make it random.

Submitted

It doesn't as I understand it, karma is awarded for rating. That means someone who is spamming votes left and right is way above me while I am taking 10-15 minutes playing every game and writing detailed feedback where possible.

Submitted

I am pretty sure it's calculated both by ratings and by comments.

Submitted

Well that's bad news for me then, I'd provided all my feedback in the thread.

Submitted

I don't think anyone uses it anyways.

Submitted

I cant tell if Ahmed Elshazly is trolling or providing a perfect example of why the system in place is not very good.

Submitted

The fact is that we need to get at least 20 votes to be in the leaderboard, and everyone would want to be in it and see how well they did, so unless everyone actually started playing and rating random games, it looks like the only way

Submitted

I don't think you need 20 votes to see your position, you just need 20 votes to have the chance of winning if you happen to have been first place in any category or overall.

Which means that it applies to 7 jammers, out of 2000.