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This is a situation where you, yet again I should add, completely disregard the content of the conversation and start nitpicking to attempt to create some sort of 'gotcha' moment instead of actually adding to the conversation. The statement isn't going to change just because I happen to refer to different content than you had in mind.

Did you create that account just to troll and sow discord and hatred or something? With every comment you post, that seems to become increasingly more true at least.

If you insist on an answer, though, I don't mind answering your question. I'm not avoiding anything at all. I'm a functional adult capable of debate, and I don't mind being corrected if I'm wrong. In fact, learning opportunities like that are usually welcomed. You should maybe try joining the debate sometimes.

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There are multiple niche fetishes present. There are several -dere types in the game; there is a sweaty, greasy tomboy and robot sex, etc. too. Not all of those are for everybody. So yes, I was more general for a reason. These ones are somewhat agreeable to the general population, though.

For the averse bit I was, however, mainly referring to, as just about everybody knows and it didn't really need saying, the hermaphrodite content. Or rather, what is wrongly tagged as 'hermaphrodite' (yes, that's what 'futanari' refers to) and is actually just gay/shemale/trans content, as they don't have both sexes but only have male sex organs.

The people that consume futa and/or gay/trans content make up a highly niche single-digit percentage of the adult population. In other words, well over 90% of the population does not enjoy that content or does not willingly seek it out at the very least.

There is nothing wrong with liking that content, of course, you do you. Nobody is judging here. It is simply the reality of the situation that it is not everybody's cup of tea.

p.s. "The content is purely optional, but that isn't enough for you, you just don't want it to exist at all." I pity you if that is what you got out of my previous statement. Content being optional is the same as it not existing already if you're not into that type of content. That was the point I was making back then. It's simply a bit of a waste for that content to be optional when it could be enjoyed by everybody if there were alternative versions. It's not the same at all. Also, for the record, it wasn't always optional. 😅

RiverXPhoenix45 days ago (3 edits)

"There is nothing wrong with liking that content, of course, you do you. Nobody is judging here. It is simply the reality of the situation that it is not everybody's cup of tea."

You contradict your previous statement. "It could probably also just be its own game, though, if we're being fair." What's "fair" about it not being in this game? This implies its existence in this game is unfair.

"The very obvious solution with including kinks in your game is usually to just make an alternate version of the kink scenes with an option to toggle the content if you want."

Why is this obvious? Why should there be versions of certain characters just to cater to people who dislike their existence in the game? Why just, not do those character's content? A tad hypocritical of you to bemoan the development of the update, yet endorse creating alternatives for certain characters.

"That was the point I was making back then. It's simply a bit of a waste for that content to be optional when it could be enjoyed by everybody if there were alternative versions."

I'm not going to get into the terminology debate, I don't care for it. But this is vile. The characters have been designed to be what they are. "Just change the gay character into a woman." There is one femboy, and 3 futas that have content. (I'm sure you'll mention the Starmaker page for Rose as well.) You have claimed "As for the 'more content' a lot of it has historically been catered to a very small minority shouting loudly on discord to have it." You never quantified what amount of "more content" exactly, it's a very small percentage of the full game.

"It's not the same at all. Also, for the record, it wasn't always optional."

I assume you're referring to the spotting minigame? So simply seeing the characters is bad, I understand.

Also claiming nobody is judging futa and femboy content is at best ignorant and more than likely purely disingenuous.

Joshua000039 days ago (1 edit)

1st of: What is wrong with you? Who hurt you? You are trying your hardest to nitpick at things to find something to critique and hate when in reality there isn't anything there. At the very least you used arguments, for which I commend you.

"This implies its existence in this game is unfair. " => No it does not in fact imply that. A 'fair judgement' is an impartial, unbiased decision based purely on facts rather than personal feelings or prejudices. I said 'it could be it's own game.' Is this not a fair and accurate statement? There is certainly enough quality content for it etc. If you don't think that is fair( thus think it is unfair), then you are arguing that it couldn't be it's own game, for whatever reason you might have for that. It has nothing to do with the existence of anything.

"Why is this obvious? " => Because if there is alternate versions of the scenes EVERYBODY gets more scenes. Did you forget that creating extra scenes doesn't only go one way perhaps? There would obviously be more scenes with the kink as well for other characters.

"I'm not going to get into the terminology debate, I don't care for it. But this is vile. The characters have been designed to be what they are." => What do you even mean by that? They were created to be living in an alternate universe already. So you believe in this one character in this one universe only but not in subsequent alternate universes with other version of the character? How do you feel about many of them having gone through changes during development then? 🤨 Technically every choice you make in game is in itself already another alternate universe as well. Are the ending characters not the real characters either then aside from the 'true ending' ones? These characters already aren't designed to simply be one single way or the other from the get-go. The players essentially design and shape them throughout the game. So by your logic the developer and everybody playing, including yourself is vile.

I read books quite often, I'm already part of thousands of alternate universes, one more doesn't really rattle my chain. I'm sorry I'm not emotionally attached enough to only believe in a single alternate universe in a single game I suppose? I really wonder why you are this emotionally invested though, genuinely.

"I assume you're referring to the spotting minigame? So simply seeing the characters is bad, I understand. " => No, you clearly do not. It is not really about seeing the characters, it is more about expectations and them being subverted. But I suppose it could be for some. It's a physiological response for a reason.

"Also claiming nobody is judging futa and femboy content is at best ignorant and more than likely purely disingenuous." => I never made this claim and I'm not sure why you're bringing it up. Is it because I said 'nobody is judging here' in reference to our conversations and you somehow assumed I was speaking for everybody here? I'll rephrase in that case: 'I'm not judging'.

Edit: For the record: Judging is a cognitive process of evaluating something based on criteria. Liking is the emotional or preferential response. They aren't 'judging' the content, they are disliking it.

Can I ask though, why are you trying so hard to hate on me for giving genuine, logical advice (critique at times, I suppose) based on facts, devoid of emotion? I've been nothing but nice and polite, yet you're slinging nothing but unfounded hate towards me. It truly perplexes me. I'm sure there are plenty of more deserving people out there.

RiverXPhoenix39 days ago

" I said 'it could be it's own game.' Is this not a fair and accurate statement?" Again, implies they don't belong in THIS game. You can try and dilute your point and use soft language all you want. You're still singling out the futa and femboy characters. "It could probably also just be its own game, though, if we're being fair." You're differentiating certain content as not belonging/fitting into Starmaker.

"These characters already aren't designed to simply be one single way or the other from the get-go." What? You're claiming the futa and femboy characters weren't designed to be futas and femboys from the get go? Prove it.

"What do you even mean by that?" I like how you completely ignore the example I use of "turn the gay man into a woman." Just toggle all the LGBT stuff, that would be "fair" after all. That stuff "could probably also just be its OWN game, though, if we're being fair."

"It is not really about seeing the characters, it is more about expectations and them being subverted." What expectations? Phoenix is on the Itch page. Arvus games has had futa and femboys since Adorevia. And yes, asking for a toggle/alternatives objectively means seeing them is bad/not wanted. It's basically an arachnophobia toggle. But, you know, for futa and femboys.

"They aren't 'judging' the content, they are disliking it. " It being optional isn't enough though, they don't want the characters to be in the game at all. They want the characters to be toggleable. Simply seeing them is bad.

The mental gymnastics you're doing to downplay this is impressive.

Joshua000013 days ago

'Again, implies they don't belong in THIS game.' No, once again it does NOT imply that. I also mentioned that it does sort of fit in the story given the world that was created. ('It sort of matches the world setting, so I can sort of understand why it's there in this case.') You are completely changing the narrative to fit your flawed logic. The statement is 'it could be it's own game' and it certainly could be. No buts or ifs about that.

'You're claiming the futa and femboy characters weren't designed to be futas and femboys from the get go? Prove it.' => Again, changing the narrative entirely. That is not what I claimed and you know it. Don't try to "read between the lines" when there is nothing there to read.

'Just toggle all the LGBT stuff, that would be "fair" after all. I like how you completely ignore the example I use of "turn the gay man into a woman."' => It's a game with customisable options. You're telling me you NEVER change the protagonist or NPCs in ANY game when they are customisable? You play with every character and setting set to 'default' because that's how it was created? I bet you changed the MC's name in this game, you hypocrite. Stop making up these braindead arguments that hold no water...

'What expectations? Phoenix is on the Itch page.' => Phoenix is, so many of the others are not.

'And yes, asking for a toggle/alternatives objectively means seeing them is bad/not wanted. It's basically an arachnophobia toggle. But, you know, for ~~futa~~ hermaphrodites and femboys.' => I suppose you are sort of correct (for once). Seeing it kills my boner and makes me physically gag at times. (Usually when I go in not knowing.) Again: 'It's a physiological response for a reason.' Do I want the content gone though? Of course not. It has every right to exist and you can't judge people's preferences and likes/dislikes. (A rule you should maybe apply yourself btw) That's why, as I've said before, the best option is usually a toggle. Or an option along the lines of 'do you want this character to use image set 1,2, or 3?' This serves everybody. Everybody gets their preferred choice. Both the 90+% of players and the <10% of players. There is no mental gymnastics or downplaying anything. All I'm saying is most people would appreciate more options. This is just a factual statement. I don't understand why you insist on arguing against something that obviously benefits all parties...

'It being optional isn't enough though, they don't want the characters to be in the game at all. They want the characters to be toggleable.' 🤔Can I maybe advise you to read this back a few times. 'They don't want it to simply be optional; they want better control over how the being optional works.' => Yeah? What's wrong with that exactly? 🤨

For the record, I wasn't really going to bring this up, but since you seem to be fixating on this whole 'LGBT' stuff so much... There are trans people in my friend group. Some I hang out with every other week. Others I play games with 2-3 times a week. And don't get me started on how many are gay/bi... I have no qualms with them, nor do I want them gone. That's just all in YOUR head. You are wanting them gone, or rather, you are wanting me to want them gone so you feel better for berating me... somehow. Well too bad because I don't.

P.S. I love how you, yet again, avoided answering the questions I asked you. What kind of mental gymnastics are you pulling off every time to avoid taking any sort of accountability for your actions? 🙃

ckyman13 days ago

Are you two ever going to stop this argument? 😅

At the end of the day, Kal decides what goes in the game and what does not (as previously stated by Dr.Muramasa).

There will be no new futa/femboy characters added. Existing ones may receive additional events, and there might be a few extra background characters, but nothing beyond that. The player is never forced to engage with these characters and will only miss out on the related futa/femboy content.
There will also be no official toggle. The game will stay open to the modding community if anyone wants to create their own.

That’s the full situation.

Dr.Muramasa13 days ago

Hello there,

Both of you need to stop this comment line as it seems you both have an opinion and are not going to get to an agreement or understanding. The content will remain as IS, no changes and no alternate versions, all such content that is causing such discussion is fully optional.

itch.io

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