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Feedback? Sticky

A topic by sonnet009games created Jan 03, 2018 Views: 975 Replies: 21
Viewing posts 1 to 12
Developer

Any feedback? Lemme have it!

I laughed, I cried, I danced wildly to the music... Wilder is one of the best indie VNs I have ever played. I love this route and I wait with bated breath for more!!

Developer

Aw, I'm glad! Thank you for playing.

This was so wonderful!  I love how it was totally different from Ran's story but the PC felt... comfortable.  I really enjoyed the same frame with such a different interior story.  Avoiding spoilers...when PC gets upset on the boat, I was seriously in tears with her.  It was so emotional.  And the farm.  That is the sweetest escape of all.  I like to imagine they go back for visits!

Developer

Aw, I'm glad that the story felt different and fresh, and I'm also glad (sorry!) that you were in tears! Thanks so much for playing.

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It was so beautiful. I love this wilder series. It is a star among everything on here. I loved Baha's route even more than Ran's. But both...make you feel so much, are so skillfully written...can't get enough.

Developer

Awww, I'm glad you enjoyed both routes so far. :-) Thank you for the lovely words.

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I loved Bahadur's route so much, he's a big ole teddy bear. His route evoked so many emotions in me, it was so good, and made an endless amount of tears stream down my face. In a good way! Gosh you can tell he cares for her so much! I love him and Ran honestly too much. I just can't stress how good their routes are. Him and Bahadur have been through so much and deserve everything! Gahh MC's aunt is deplorable , I hated her in Ran's route but I especially hated her in this one. Even if she did kind of redeem herself in the end, I can't forgive her for doing what she did to Bahadur. However, if anyone is more loathsome than her i'd have to say its the Uncle. Because at least she became a more respectable person in the end. But, gosh the scene with Anisa was so incredibly heartwarming, and the farm scene all together was such a rose-colored romantic scene that made me feel so warm and fuzzy inside. The sweet ending was absolutely perfect, I wouldn't change a thing about it, my heart is completely satiated. Although, I wouldn't mind the epilogues you talked about. Wilder seriously has such a beautiful story to tell. T-T Also kind off topic but I saw a post on your tumblr , about how humans and Djinn can't reproduce, mann my dreams of seeing cute little half Djinn half human babies is dashed. However, as sad as my dreams being dashed is, it might be for the better. There would probably be a lot of unwanted children if it was possible. But..hey I can still fantasize about the cute little kiddos mc would have with Ran or Bahadur right?Oh shoot, also I'm not sure if I mentioned this but the writing is done very well, and the art is gorgeous. It is all so very aesthetically pleasing. Bahadur and Ran are very attractive. Also I'm not sure if It's the lighting, but MC's hair in the CG looks a dark emerald green, and I think its really pretty and unique. Lol sorry if that's a weird observation, and sorry that my feed back is all over the place.

Needless to say I am obsessed with the Wilder series.

Developer

What an incredible piece of feedback! Thank you for taking the time to write so many of your thoughts -- it's no exaggeration that this kind of thing makes my whole day. :-D

On the subject of human-djinn babies, canon is canon. But, hey, that's the beauty of fanon, isn't it! ;-) And regarding MC's hair -- it's actually a deep brown, but sometimes the lighting of a scene can make it look green.

Thanks again! This made me giddy to read!

Omg you are very welcome 😊 I love your Wilder series and I hope I was able to convey that through my feed back. It makes me so happy that it made your day, because your game makes my week. Still I apologize that my feedback was a chaotic mess , I had so many thoughts and just typed them out without even ruminating over how messy it looks.

(+1)

Hi~
I see you're asking for feedback on this game, correct? I played the game as I saw a post on englishotome's tumblr; from my understanding you're also the creator of Aloners?! That was the first free otome I played, and extremely impressed me, especially as you were able to make a game compelling even with the knowledge there were only two endings and a "set" MC personality. I'll stop there as this post isn't about Aloners. Spoilers ahead! 

I say that to say...I'm not as impressed with Bahadur's Story, and perhaps the Wilder series (haven't played Ran so can't judge).  The MC and Bahadur never really grabbed me as authentic nor realistically attracted to one another. The MC I understand is young, a tad spoiled, and naive, but her actions annoyed me (i.e. her objection to the marriage seemed ungrateful considering the times she's living in). I.E she buys alcohol for Bahadur, a djinn slave, and gets upset when he won't sit beside her instead of behind her when they're in a public location.  And still be upset when Bahadur explains they need to blend in. There's a time and place for making a proud statement, and that wasn't one of those times, and lead away from seeing the MC as sensible.

Later,  I couldn't see indicators to support the growth/assumed maturity she experiences later in the story.  One such example is after she and Bahadur have relations on the boat. After he starts to treat her the same as before, the MC assumes it's b/c  he sees her as the aunt, and shields her self in her room pouting/crying. This situation/scene came across as very self-centered on the MC's part, considering I feel we are supposed to feel for her in this moment.  Considering Bahadur's sexual abuse (and trauma)  from the aunt and the MC knowing this, the fact that she turned the situation (his "back to slave thinking" mentality) to be about her emotions/feelings/actions (i.e. "I can't believe I'm doing  this to him", "I feel horrible." etc. so I'm going to sulk) rather than his (Bahadur has to not only seek her out first, but insist she's not hurting him afterwards) made me see her as still very  immature and not truly putting his feelings first. Even towards the end of the game when her uncle, and the others start to reveal the larger plots to the story, the MC's reaction of anger came across as still immature and selfish, mainly indirectly putting her emotions above the needs of others; tbh,I even kinda sided with the Uncle at the end. He may have been conniving, but to me that's realistic for his career, the times, the setting, and what would have been achieved had he been successful. The MC sees the world too idealistically and short-sighted, thus we could never connect enough for me to identify with her or insert myself into her role.

MC aside, Bahadur sadly came across as a little "one note." I feel he fits into the "lifelong friend," "older brother" or "butler" trope, which is fine. But, I couldn't get a grasp on why he always liked/loved the MC. Like, what about her? What's attractive? He's known her so long that it felt like he saw her as a "purity token" (not sure that makes sense, so I apologize) to his strong feelings of guilt. He came across so accepting of her behaviours not matter what she did/said. I kinda wished we saw them butt heads or something so we could a view of their compatibility beyond them "liking" each other.  I know his devotion is to be seen as romantic, but it seemed sad to me; Bahadur came across as so unconditionally devoted to be dependent on her acceptance/adoration/relationship, rather than attaining a stronger sense of esteem and himself. Even how the MC was able to "love him" out of his drug-induced rage in the jail instead of something involving him doing it on his own  seemed a tad cliché, kinda sad, showing to me not a loving moment, but one showing how much he needs her rather than himself, indirectly in a way supporting the slave-master/co-dependent relationship the story seems to want Bahadur/ them to move beyond.

Lastly,  I  freely admit to being overly sensitive about romanticizing slave/slave master relationships. I am a POC woman w/ a background in cross-cultural studies and my family history is, of course, riddled with unromantic slave/master relationships. So, please understand I try not to hold my personal feelings on this subject matter against you or your story, especially as anything or situation can be written about. And, I'm assuming we're coming from different backgrounds. I know I may be taking this too seriously, but I must say I never felt completely comfortable with the portrayal of Bahadur's love for the MC nor the MC's love/view of Bahadur.  Something rubbed me too "you validate me, so I can love/accept myself" or "Uncle Tom-like" on Bahadur's part; this was hard for me to read as this sense of self-perception is a real train of thought I see in my POC community who idealize White cultures/people and seek validation from them rather in themselves first and foremost, especially after the years of being seen as lessors. I can't put it completely in words, but Bahadur just made me sigh sadly on the inside and want more for him. At first, I didn't like his character and antics, (always forgiving the MC, unconditional support, not letting her blame herself even if it's her fault, constantly reassuring her she's better or not like other humans, loving how MC accepts the "shameful, unclean" person he is, etc. ) until a few days later I realized all those things are the same actions I've seen and read concerning POC past and present who lost their sense of self to the point of seeing their worth through the eyes of their oppressors.  A little too pitiful for me. 

The MC in the relationship gave me heavy "it's not me it's them"/"I'm colorblind"/" human guilt" vibes. I never felt like she completely tried to see the world through Bahadur's or a djinn's eyes beyond "slavery is not right" and "they're equal to humans." So seemed delusional to the deeper effects of djinn slavery and people's lives, especially when the MC makes a comment of something along the lines "so you don't see me as useful? "able to do anything?" in response to a conversation with Bahadur and Anisa. All I could think was, "are you serious? I'm sure it's has more to do with him being the slave and you his master for over 18 years is more in his mind." As someone who struggles answering how some of my non-POC friends over how they can show allyship and show empathy while accepting their privilege as a simple reality, I felt by the end of the story the MC wasn't ready or self-aware to be in healthy relationship with a djinn, let alone Bahadur, one so close, attached, and meaningfully interwoven into her life/upbringing. 

I'm very sorry if I come across too critical of your hard work on you story and visual novel. But, I'd rather be honest than patronize you as I have more respect for you as a writer and a person than that, even more so for how much I enjoyed your storytelling in Aloners. I do commend your efforts and wish you luck in your future works. It may be that I am not the audience for this particular series, the Wilder series, for a variety of reasons, the young MC and the portrayal of slave/master relations not my cup of tea being the main ones. I hope you take my words with a cup of salt, and not too harshly. You are brave to submit your work to the eyes of strangers on the internet. 
Good luck with your future projects.

Developer(+1)

Thank you for taking the time to write such a detailed and honest criticism of Bahadur's Story.

Most things, I can see your point -- but I do stand by the story. The main character is young, and she's written to be young. She and Bahadur do have an unhealthy dependency on each other (like you mentioned, she is his "purity token", his opinions are coloured by being conditioned to feel "shameful" and "unclean") but they are supposed to be flawed, pitiful characters who, by the game's end, have at least a hope of growing together and making a better future for themselves.

Of course, if that's not the feeling you got at all, then that's my failure as a writer, and I will seek to improve -- not just in future routes and games, but by looking back at Bahadur's Story and seeing if/where I can strengthen the backbone of the narrative.

It's probably one of the hardest things I've ever read -- to have Bahadur be called "Uncle Tom". I am genuinely mortified that this is a take someone could have, and obviously the absolute last comparison I'd intend to be drawn to this character. Though I would argue that breaking free of his servility (once admitting that it is in fact his own defense mechanism against the parts of himself that scare him) is a core part of Bahadur's story and character development -- not a reinforcement of the "servile minority" stereotype. But, regardless, this teaches me to cast an even more critical eye over my own characters, to ensure that they do not come off as unintentionally offensive.

Ultimately, I can completely understand why this game does not work for you, though I stand by it. I will certainly take some of the points you've made and aim to improve in areas I feel are lacking or misaimed, but ultimately Wilder is what it is.

Thank you for your feedback. It has been very valuable.

Just finished Bahadurs play through aaaaannnd I honestly think its one of the best Otome games I've ever played. Story is huge for me, and most of the mainstream Otomes that I've been playing have consistently been letting me down story wise. Then I saw this and...the story is interesting, the characters have depth and aren't stereotypes (something Otome has a problem with in my opinion--always with the same personalities and romances just in different settings with different names...) I honestly couldn't stop reading it. What especially surprised me was Lamya and how, though a villain, she is fleshed out to show she is also a person. I took her rapey rich lady persona at face value and kinda dismissed her as a plot device for drama in the beginning, but the ending surprised me by booting BOTH her parental figures out of their 2dimensional stereotypes (the 'good' and 'bad' parent personas). It proves that humans can be awful even when they are perceived as good people, and that those who are generally selfish and awful are still capable of doing good things. 

Anyways I love this story, love the twist, love how the relationship develops and all the moral and consent issues that are brought up and agonized over. Ending was great, although I haven't played through the bitter ending (I'm so awful with unhappy endings but I am curious...) I'll probably go back and read through Rans next, who I didn't do first since he's just not really my type of guy...but I love the protagonist and the story and I want to see more of the characters and world that are in that story so I'll buy it anyways :)

Some constructive criticism: The scenes at the farm: I feel like you need an inside of the house background and a sprite for the blind woman, but I understand why you didn't have one (time/budget constraints probably). She feels like such an important part of the story though that its a bit of a disservice to not even give her a face. The romance CG that you get in the barn also felt a bit awkward compared to the other ones in the story, maybe because its the only one that shows the MC and also it was framed a bit awkwardly with her creepy blank face (I know thats something a lot of Otomes do, but I personally think its better when shots are just framed so you see the MC from the back or something). The others were lovely though, and Bahadur always looked gorgeous. Also when they go into the town the background and music for the town really jarred me from the setting of the story. It was consistently eastern inspired architecture and music and then suddenly you're in western europe? I mean I get they went over the mountains but...maybe you should change up the background pic or at least add additional dialogue that addresses the change in culture a bit more?

Altogether seriously a great game, it has pulled me from my Otome slump with its originality, fleshed out and interesting characters, and a protagonist that realizes her flaws and works to better herself (or not maybe in the bitter ending lol?). Can't wait to try out Ran, and especially to see the romance with Royo! I really liked her, although I have no idea how these other romances are going to happen since you have to run away with either bahadur or ran in the beginning to avoid capture and imprisonment...and you don't meet Royo until you journey to Umar. Does she escape with one of them and then get captured? Is there a version where the shah doesn't die and she ends up going to Umar for political reasons or something? I'm excited to see what you come up with!

Developer

Wow, that's high praise -- thank you! And I'll take your constructive criticism on board.

Hopefully you'll enjoy discovering how the protagonist finds herself in various different scenarios depending on the route. I'll say that, for Royo's Story, you do meet her before Umar -- in a very interesting way. ;-)

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The game is amazing, i love how consistent and  well written the story is. Not forgetting the stunning art and music. 

I spent all morning  playing Bahadur's route,  it was really enjoyable, and heart wrenching at times; there's a good amount of drama in your story  and that's exactly what i seek in these type of games. ^^

The time they spent in the farm and how Anisa called them their children was so beautiful, so genuine 😭 I felt like crying my eyes out. 

All in all, I'm patiently waiting for your next game, good luck, and thank you :) 

Developer

Thank you! I'm so glad that you enjoyed the drama -- and the parts where I did my best to tug at your heartstrings. ;-)

Hi! I was wondering if we purchase all of the routes separately will we get a free version of the full game? and/or a steam key?

Developer

That's correct! You will be able to download the full version for free. (Also, at this stage, a Steam version has not been confirmed.)

WOW, how is it possible that you keep surpassing all my expectations? Such a rollercoaster of emotions that my roommate had to come by multiple times to ask what I was yelling about haha! I loved the farm interlude so much, getting to see the MC become more self sufficient and independent just made me giddy! Playing through your games is always such a treat, always consistently well written, dramatic, and in this case fluffy AF! Seriously though one of my favourite things about your games is that you make it so easy to love the MC as much as the other characters, the way her character comes out and flourishes is so unique and rewarding- something I don't see a lot of in a typical VNs. It took me a criminally long time to check back in with this series after Ran's Story, but I suppose that just means it'll feel like a shorter wait between instalments! Thank you so much for letting all of us enjoy your hard work!

Developer

Oh, wow. Thank you for this! You have no idea how happy it's made me on an otherwise very tense day.

I'm especially glad that you enjoy the MC. She can be difficult to write sometimes, trying to make her feel both developed but also something of a player avatar. So I'm constantly worried that she'll be considered either too blank or too unrelatable! ^^;

This is by far the best otome I'v ever played! All of your games never fail to rip my heart out in the best of ways <3 Ty for this beautiful and tear jerking experience! I still cant believe I cried actual tears. (  :  u : )b

Absolutely loved it ^^ Money well spent.