Post by Bluesaan in That's not my Neighbor comments

Viewing post in That's not my Neighbor comments

I'm gonna say this again if people still gonna ask for a refund and accuse Nachosama for wanting money only and not because he wants to share his own game.

It's honestly really wild and disappointing that most of people here are always complaining about "having to buy twice" and "he broke his promises" as their strongest argument when the game has always been just $3. Nachosama didn't raise the price of the original game, didn't upcharge for the remake, and he admitted his mistakes, apologized for many times after he couldn't promised the Steam Key and Itch.io refund, yet, people really backlashed him so much to the point they destroyed his passion for TNMN and his other future work.

"But it's still their money, no matter the amount, he forced people to buy twice!" So, are you guys gonna ignoring the amount of effort he put into TNMN as well? He made the game ENTIRELY by himself, he made the game from scratch, concept art, UI/UX, coding, prototype, final artwork, and everything that involves game development. As a college student and artist, i know it's really HARD to do all of that ALONE, Nachosama managed to success with TNMN because he was really motivated to create such a unique game entirely by himself, and he still charged the game in such incredibly low prices than most indie devs would. Not to mention that his game got really popular, he could've raise the price for the remake if he wants to but NOPE, Nachosama didn't want you to pay in a higher price because he GENUINELY wanted to SHARE his own game, NOT scamming you out of fortune.

People also forgot the fact that devs NEED TO PROTECT THEIR GAME FROM PIRACY. Nachosama stated that his game has been STOLEN multiple times and people made profit off of it which it is absolute CRIME & DISRESPECTFUL TO DEVELOPERS. It's also one of most valid reason for him to move his own game to Steam because Steam has stronger security than Itch.io, but some people fail to realize this and ignore this copyrights problem. Nacho didn't mind it at first, but seeing how some of you backlash him because he decided to remake and expand the game to Steam, you immediately throw the "YOU'RE SO ARROGANT FOR 'FORCING' US TO BUY TWICE!!!" and calling him "greedy" while the real ones who are being greedy here are the people who only cares about their own MONEY & FREE STUFF from his game.

So the point of my comment? Just GIVE HIM A BREAK. Respect every of his decision, understand what he already stated instead of asking the same thing that is already explained by him for many times. It's NO USE if you keep harassing him because now he already discouraged from continuing TNMN and his other work. He also probably got really traumatized after all of the backlash that was happening in here. Some of you just decided to disrespect him in any unhinged way possible when he was already falling down, that's honestly such a pathetic move and you should be ashamed of yourself for disrespecting him this much.

If you're still disagree with me? Then it's your choice! It's your choice if you want to downvote my comment as well. I fight against those who insulted Nachosama because i got FREAKING DISAPPOINTED TO SEE MY FAVORITE DEV BEING DISRESPECTED THIS MUCH. This just proves Nacho that most of people here are just fake fans who only care about their own money and not his work once he couldn't fulfill his promises while the "sane" TNMN fans out there are way more reasonable with their constructive criticisms after he released the remake in Steam.

Thank you if you read this and i hope you have a ✨nice day or night!!!✨ 😊👍👍👍

Naughty Mono248 days ago(+3)(-1)

Thank you very much for those important words!

TheGamingMan734246 days ago(+2)(-1)

If Nachosama truly wanted to share his game, he could’ve easily updated the Itch.io version instead of removing it from future updates. Moving to Steam for better security makes sense, but it’s also easy to pirate the Steam version, so piracy isn't a solid reason for not updating Itch.io. Games like Buckshot Roulette updated both versions, proving it's possible to support both platforms.

The developer went back and forth between saying "I truly wish I could give it to everyone for free" and "It's a new build, so I deserve it to be repurchased." His inconsistent stance only adds to the backlash. He broke several promises, and instead of updating the Itch.io version, something that could've easily been done, he told everyone he’d offer refunds, only to realize he couldn’t issue refunds after 90 days. I’m not blaming him for that, but it shows that lack of research led to these issues. It’s frustrating that with such a simple solution, he chose not to take it, especially when some games on Itch.io thrive despite piracy being "easier." This doesn’t seem like a valid reason to avoid updating Itch.io.

If he was truly willing to offer every single person a refund, then the whole piracy argument becomes irrelevant. If he’s offering refunds, it shows he's not concerned about people getting the game for free, which undermines the claim that piracy was the reason for moving to Steam. It makes sense that if he's willing to provide refunds, he could have simply updated the Itch.io version without worrying about piracy.

I think if he had a more consistent stance there’d be less backlash. Even if that stance from the start had been "This is a new game. If you want it, you need to pay for it again," it still would have gotten some backlash, considering buyers were told they’d get future updates for free. But I feel the backlash would have been less.

Bluesaan246 days ago(-2)

Oh, haha, i've noticed that you're still not backing down, i see. How fascinating! But since it seems like you're always talking about Nachosama's inconsistency, how about you go take a mirror first and take a look back at your previous comment compared to what you've been talking recently, then we can talk about it further if you still can explain what you actually really wanted! 🥸

TheGamingMan734245 days ago(+1)(-1)

What? My inconsistencies I mentioned are still perfectly valid? I'm talking about his inconsistencies throughout the development stages.

He claimed free indefinite updates of the game. September 28, 2024: “If you bought the game once, you won’t need to buy it again. You will always have access to all future updates.” and May 21, 2024: “Remember that if you already bought the game, you DO NOT need to purchase it again. The game is bought once, and you will always have access to all future files I upload.” To then "re-release" the game and call it a different game.
He claimed he wanted to give free Steam keys. Said he cannot give free Steam keys because he was limited to 100 Steam keys (which is perfectly reasonable if it's valid). However, if he was set on giving Steam keys for free, that means he had the intention of giving the Steam update for free. If that was the case, he could have achieved this goal by simply updating the itch.io version.
He then, in replies, started saying, "I just made another game, the game on itch was finished long ago," making it clear he never planned to give the Steam version for free. His own words in the screenshot confirm this.
He promised free refunds and then said he can't because of the 90-day limit (again, this is completely fair. He should have really done research before this. With all the backlash, you’d think he’d do extensive research before making any promises he might not be able to keep).

The game being "finished on itch.io" doesn't mean he couldn't simply release a separate downloadable file that was the Steam version if he again claimed he wanted to give the Steam version away for free for original backers.

He clearly was working on the Steam version for a while. Why not tell everyone, "Ok, guys. This itch.io version is done! I am making a Steam version of the game that is a remake. That remake will not be given to itch.io users because it is a new version of the game"? This may have gotten a tiny bit of backlash. However, nowhere near the backlash he got with all these hiccups. At the end of the day, a fanbase wants to feel like there is honesty and communication between them and the developer. When a new Steam game is released and then told, "You guys aren't getting it because it's a separate game" (and yes, this is basically what he's saying because again he'd just add the files on itch.io for original backers), it's going to leave a sour taste in people's mouths. That’s just how it is. Even more so when fans are expecting updates to the game because they haven’t been informed it is finished. Again, if he was working on the Steam version, he could, in the latest update to the itch.io version, just tell the fans that there will be no more updates to the game because he's remaking it for Steam with new features.

He is a solo developer, so I’m not putting him in the same leagues as a greedy corporate company. However, to say you will give indefinite free updates, then give the game a facelift for a Steam release and claim it's a new game isn’t exactly keeping to that narrative.

A part of development of the game can be re-working it from the ground up. That's very common in the gaming industry, from small indie games (like Risk of Rain (Remastered), Spelunky (HD), and Fez) to triple-A games. That doesn't warrant a re-purchase of the game when updates were promised for free and no prior warning was made to say the itch.io version of the game was complete.

Bluesaan244 days ago (1 edit) (+2)(-1)

Oh wow, you really dropped a thesis-length reply this time, but that's absolutely okay and i honestly appreciate that! Now, i'm gonna write my long argument as well to point out your missing points.

First of all, you were already inconsistent with what you've said. You said to the dev like "You clearly don't want to release the Steam version on Itch.io" while that's technically an unfeasible thing to do. Why? Because both version are built on different frameworks, and i already told you why it is impossible to do. Despite some of the art assets may look the same, the mechanics and coding were entirely redone from scratch to fit Steam's requirement. The whole remake is build for Steam version, it's not really like you simply drag and drop the files and BOOM- "TNMN remake is finished within just a few hours and i can put this in Itch.Io as well!"

• "He claimed free indefinite updates of the game. To then "re-release" the game and call it a different game." Nachosama literally stated multiple times that the Itch.io version is already FINISHED. He stated "free indefinite updates" for Itch version, the Steam is another version. TNMN Itch.io version have 3 FREE updates after the og game released, they're Nightmare, Endless, and Campaign Mode. The game ended on Campaign Mode and he decided to remake and expand the game to Steam because he wants to TRY something new and to reach out more people as well. The remake is NOT an update to Itch.io version but most people still failing so hard to understand this. People still complaining about his mistakes and decisions while no developer can predict the future perfectly. He delivered multiple free updates as promised, but as a solo dev, he eventually had to decide how to continue sustainably (and trying to avoid piracy as well). People who treated his mistakes like a "betrayal" really shows that they're ignoring how indie development works. It's his own decision with his OWN game, so plans can change, no matter what.

• "However, if he was set on giving Steam keys for free, that means he had the intention of giving the Steam update for free." No, that's not how game development works buddy. Remake is not always something you can get for free, he still worked hard for that and deserve to get paid. You kept saying it's "Steam update" while in reality that it's a rebuild version. It's also a Steam policy if he can only give 100 keys, not completely his fault, and he already apologized for many times that he didn't aware of that restrictions. It's not up to him how many keys he can give because Steam keys are limited by Valve, not by Nachosama himself.

• "Just tell the fans that there will be no more updates to the game because he's remaking it for Steam with new features." The game itself literally SHOWS that the whole game is already finished, if Nacho still really need to explain it that much, then they're clearly ignoring the progress of the development. I'm gonna explain this through the images below this text.

After reading the whole text, i can conclude that you're just trying to paint Nachosama as dishonest, even when the facts prove otherwise. He's an indie dev who tried to figure things out and worked alone for his game, but people just never understand the struggle of game development and problems that indie devs need to face. He could've update and improve the game more if people here were a bit nicer, but instead of giving constructive criticisms, they didn't even give him a break and decided to backlash him with entitled complaints, who act like they're owed free content forever, which is why he eventually discouraged from continuing TNMN and his other future work.

I'm actually still curious if you're still trying to find another reasons as a counter to justify your arguments. I'm honestly really fascinated that you even wrote a longer text this time, but that doesn't change the fact that all of my arguments are still better and reasonable because i already managed to bring down those who also tried to bring Nachosama down when he was already falling down. I don't even mind if i have to write a really long thesis just to point out your missing points again, because my whole intention was good from the start, trying to defend a developer who's been struggling after all of the backlash and insults he's been facing when he literally didn't deserve all of that disrespect. So go ahead if you still have another argument, i'm still really interested with what you're going to reply this time! 😀👍

TheGamingMan734244 days ago(+1)(-1)

Brother you win. You can bend over to dishonest developers. I give up trying to explain anything to you. Nothing can penetrate your undying love for nacho.

Bluesaan243 days ago(-3)

MetalGearOpz87245 days ago (1 edit) (+1)(-2)

The piracy scare needs to stop. Plenty of games get pirated, and they still do well. Maybe because 90% of gamers aren't thieves, and it insults us to make this kind of insinuation.

Edit: And also, not knocking on the guy's hard work, but calling this a "unique" game is a stretch. This is basically a Papers, Please clone. lol

Bluesaan245 days ago(-4)

"Plenty of games get pirated, and they still do well." Bro's acting like piracy isn't a big deal while Nachosama literally an indie dev who struggles and deserve to get paid for his hard work alone. Piracy might not kill AAA studios, but for a solo dev, every sale counts.

"90% of gamers aren't thieves" says WHO?? Did i ever assume that "90% of gamers are thieves for pirating his game"??? That's why he said "multiple times", not everyone, because there are people who actually stole his game and made a profit off of it. The Itch.io version also has raw files that makes it easier for people who want to get it for free while Steam makes it harder because it has stronger security and protection.

"This is basically a Papers, Please clone." Laziest take i've always seen. Just because a game has similar mechanic, doesn't mean it's completely a clone. They both still have different concept, art style, and story. Papers Please is more about politics, ethics, and survival while TNMN is more about paranoia, horror, and deception based from the doppelgangers situation.

Go make some actual better argument if you want to use it as a counter instead of trying to sound smart, you're just gonna embarrass yourself even more if you're still trying to make this kind of argument again. 🥸