Post by TheGamingMan734 in That's not my Neighbor comments

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What? My inconsistencies I mentioned are still perfectly valid? I'm talking about his inconsistencies throughout the development stages.

He claimed free indefinite updates of the game. September 28, 2024: “If you bought the game once, you won’t need to buy it again. You will always have access to all future updates.” and May 21, 2024: “Remember that if you already bought the game, you DO NOT need to purchase it again. The game is bought once, and you will always have access to all future files I upload.” To then "re-release" the game and call it a different game.
He claimed he wanted to give free Steam keys. Said he cannot give free Steam keys because he was limited to 100 Steam keys (which is perfectly reasonable if it's valid). However, if he was set on giving Steam keys for free, that means he had the intention of giving the Steam update for free. If that was the case, he could have achieved this goal by simply updating the itch.io version.
He then, in replies, started saying, "I just made another game, the game on itch was finished long ago," making it clear he never planned to give the Steam version for free. His own words in the screenshot confirm this.
He promised free refunds and then said he can't because of the 90-day limit (again, this is completely fair. He should have really done research before this. With all the backlash, you’d think he’d do extensive research before making any promises he might not be able to keep).

The game being "finished on itch.io" doesn't mean he couldn't simply release a separate downloadable file that was the Steam version if he again claimed he wanted to give the Steam version away for free for original backers.

He clearly was working on the Steam version for a while. Why not tell everyone, "Ok, guys. This itch.io version is done! I am making a Steam version of the game that is a remake. That remake will not be given to itch.io users because it is a new version of the game"? This may have gotten a tiny bit of backlash. However, nowhere near the backlash he got with all these hiccups. At the end of the day, a fanbase wants to feel like there is honesty and communication between them and the developer. When a new Steam game is released and then told, "You guys aren't getting it because it's a separate game" (and yes, this is basically what he's saying because again he'd just add the files on itch.io for original backers), it's going to leave a sour taste in people's mouths. That’s just how it is. Even more so when fans are expecting updates to the game because they haven’t been informed it is finished. Again, if he was working on the Steam version, he could, in the latest update to the itch.io version, just tell the fans that there will be no more updates to the game because he's remaking it for Steam with new features.

He is a solo developer, so I’m not putting him in the same leagues as a greedy corporate company. However, to say you will give indefinite free updates, then give the game a facelift for a Steam release and claim it's a new game isn’t exactly keeping to that narrative.

A part of development of the game can be re-working it from the ground up. That's very common in the gaming industry, from small indie games (like Risk of Rain (Remastered), Spelunky (HD), and Fez) to triple-A games. That doesn't warrant a re-purchase of the game when updates were promised for free and no prior warning was made to say the itch.io version of the game was complete.

Bluesaan280 days ago (1 edit) (+2)(-1)

Oh wow, you really dropped a thesis-length reply this time, but that's absolutely okay and i honestly appreciate that! Now, i'm gonna write my long argument as well to point out your missing points.

First of all, you were already inconsistent with what you've said. You said to the dev like "You clearly don't want to release the Steam version on Itch.io" while that's technically an unfeasible thing to do. Why? Because both version are built on different frameworks, and i already told you why it is impossible to do. Despite some of the art assets may look the same, the mechanics and coding were entirely redone from scratch to fit Steam's requirement. The whole remake is build for Steam version, it's not really like you simply drag and drop the files and BOOM- "TNMN remake is finished within just a few hours and i can put this in Itch.Io as well!"

• "He claimed free indefinite updates of the game. To then "re-release" the game and call it a different game." Nachosama literally stated multiple times that the Itch.io version is already FINISHED. He stated "free indefinite updates" for Itch version, the Steam is another version. TNMN Itch.io version have 3 FREE updates after the og game released, they're Nightmare, Endless, and Campaign Mode. The game ended on Campaign Mode and he decided to remake and expand the game to Steam because he wants to TRY something new and to reach out more people as well. The remake is NOT an update to Itch.io version but most people still failing so hard to understand this. People still complaining about his mistakes and decisions while no developer can predict the future perfectly. He delivered multiple free updates as promised, but as a solo dev, he eventually had to decide how to continue sustainably (and trying to avoid piracy as well). People who treated his mistakes like a "betrayal" really shows that they're ignoring how indie development works. It's his own decision with his OWN game, so plans can change, no matter what.

• "However, if he was set on giving Steam keys for free, that means he had the intention of giving the Steam update for free." No, that's not how game development works buddy. Remake is not always something you can get for free, he still worked hard for that and deserve to get paid. You kept saying it's "Steam update" while in reality that it's a rebuild version. It's also a Steam policy if he can only give 100 keys, not completely his fault, and he already apologized for many times that he didn't aware of that restrictions. It's not up to him how many keys he can give because Steam keys are limited by Valve, not by Nachosama himself.

• "Just tell the fans that there will be no more updates to the game because he's remaking it for Steam with new features." The game itself literally SHOWS that the whole game is already finished, if Nacho still really need to explain it that much, then they're clearly ignoring the progress of the development. I'm gonna explain this through the images below this text.

After reading the whole text, i can conclude that you're just trying to paint Nachosama as dishonest, even when the facts prove otherwise. He's an indie dev who tried to figure things out and worked alone for his game, but people just never understand the struggle of game development and problems that indie devs need to face. He could've update and improve the game more if people here were a bit nicer, but instead of giving constructive criticisms, they didn't even give him a break and decided to backlash him with entitled complaints, who act like they're owed free content forever, which is why he eventually discouraged from continuing TNMN and his other future work.

I'm actually still curious if you're still trying to find another reasons as a counter to justify your arguments. I'm honestly really fascinated that you even wrote a longer text this time, but that doesn't change the fact that all of my arguments are still better and reasonable because i already managed to bring down those who also tried to bring Nachosama down when he was already falling down. I don't even mind if i have to write a really long thesis just to point out your missing points again, because my whole intention was good from the start, trying to defend a developer who's been struggling after all of the backlash and insults he's been facing when he literally didn't deserve all of that disrespect. So go ahead if you still have another argument, i'm still really interested with what you're going to reply this time! 😀👍

TheGamingMan734280 days ago(+1)(-1)

Brother you win. You can bend over to dishonest developers. I give up trying to explain anything to you. Nothing can penetrate your undying love for nacho.

Bluesaan279 days ago(-3)