I can play ASCII roguelikes and have a lot in the past (mostly pre-dcss versions of Crawl and Dwarf Fortress till this day), but I am generally a fan of well done tiles. It's also why I stuck with tiles in my own roguelike.
If width is reduced, you can always get away with making the font a bit smaller. UI is kinda massive at the moment. I am speaking from a PC player perspective though, not sure how the game looks on mobile devices. I suppose these massive fonts are there because of these platforms?
Recent community posts
I can play ASCII roguelikes and have a lot in the past (mostly pre-dcss versions of Crawl and Dwarf Fortress till this day), but I am generally a fan of well done tiles. It's also why I stuck with tiles in my own roguelike.
The "After" variant is far clearer but walls have lost quite a bit of detail. It's a tradeoff and I'd go with the new one anyway, but if you were able to add some variety (eg. occasional cracks) or pattern to these walls, so that they're not absolutely uniform slabs, that would give you best of both worlds.
Hi! Glad to hear you like the game.
From left to right, these symbols are: Tissue Health, Structure Health (bones), and then the 3 shields represent armor rating against Slash, Blunt and Fire damage.
If you hit and hold Ctrl, that should display enemy preview window, same one as the L mode shows and it will usually try to show you the last enemy you hit, or closest enemy. If you keep pressing V while holding Ctrl, it wil cycle through all visible enemies.
You weren't the only one to have trouble with that font. I felt it was ok, but then after swapping to another one (had to do some clenaup and refactoring in the code to allow such swaps) I realised just how unreadable the old one was in comparison.
Glad you like the new ones!
I actually have an artist in my sights who has a lot of decent quality music available with a fantasy twist (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCG46uU4jlxak8DvmcVqN2oQ) and is willing to share her music for free. I like a good number of these tracks and can already see some of them in particular areas of the game.
I just need to sort out the engine (sounds work well, but the entire "music player" part seems very wonky and doesn't like any music files I throw at it, might end up writing my own player) and some of my internet issues (forced to work with low-transfer-limit LTE connection instead of broadband, can't stream much with that :/).
But music definitely is coming soon-ish.
Yea, itch.io has issues today with uploading pictures. Could you send me screenshots and/or the save file on firstname.lastname@example.org? This is really intriguing as I cannot reproduce it on my own at all.
Are you 100% sure you made the Fire Aura spell type "User", and didn't just cast it on the kobold by mistake? I can't count how many times I've given my enemies some beneficial effects by forgetting to switch that. It would explain both behaviours at once. You can see who has the spell applied when looking at the kobold (either hold ctrl or press L and move over kim). The creature having fira aura will have an icon showing that they are affected by the spell.
I've done some research and it seems this is a false positive for Panda that comes up from time to time on their forums, and it's affecting some of the .exe files. As I keep uploading Dungeonlike in a SFX archive, it's always a different .exe file each time, so maybe I should just do a simple .zip instead, as many people on Itch.io seem to be doing.
Not sure how up to date your Panda is (it being out of date seems like the only explanation as to why my freshly installed version does not flag any issues while your does), but I see they keep getting posts on their forums about this (bunch of forum posts), then developers submit apps to be whitelisted and that gets updated in next versions.
Anyway, thanks for raising this and for the follow up with details! Got me quite scared there for a second when I realised that I don't perform any scans on these archives before uploading them, so there always was a chance for a virus to tag along. Added a routine antivirus scan to my list of "deployment procedures" I perform before any version is released, just to keep it safer.
If anybody is waiting for the file to be back up for download, I will install and run Panda Anti-Virus on the archive at home later tonight (seeing as this is the antivir which found the issue) and if it doesn't pick anything up in there, I will re-enable the download. I'm pretty confident there is nothing wrong with the archive, but I'd rather check it out myself.
I ran Sophos on it, in both archived and extracted formats, didn't bring anything up. Would you be so kind to show me some report from Panda Anti-Virus which identifies the virus it found in the archive?
Oh wow, bloody Itch.io did not bother to notice me about your answer. With the corner of my eye I noticed "hey, there shouldn't be 5 posts under that topic!". How unreliable, I assumed it just gives me notice of everything... So there goes a month-delayed response:
With respect to how complex the health system is/will be I definitely want to hit that sweet balance spot between super-simple "one hp bar" approach and DF's "your thumb's fingernail was broken" approach. It has to be simple enough to allow good UI readability without going into menus (at the moment you can see your entire health state on the bottom panel, and that needs to remain possible). Yet it has to be complex enough to allow multiple approaches to combat and different handling of various enemies.
Oh and many weapons already have their own specific attacks like stabs, flatside attacks, arced swings etc.
Now, I like the mechanics of the first solution and I think some of it could make it into the game even without additional health types. The game already features two, which is Tissue (which could be understood as tissue+muscle, pretty much all the "meaty" stuff) and Structure (which can be understood as bones, but for future enemies like stone golems, it's... wel it's structure :D). So I like the idea of influencing combat performance through missing HP - at the moment you need to cut tissue to 0% or damage structure dramatically to break the bone, but otherwise, an enemy with 5% tissue health on his arm still hits the same as he did with 100%, which is rather silly. That could definitely get some upgrades. Also, instead of having a dedicated hp pool for tendons, having them damaged could be a Condition which arises in certain situations (eg. critical strikes with slashing weapons) and it would block the body part from use altogether (much like having your bone broken works at the moment).
I consider Elona one of my main inspirations, along with ToME, Dwarf Fortress and some others. I liked the customisability of your character, all the wacky mutations, many ways of influencing the items (changing materials/making stuff +4 etc) and on top of that an open world with your own house/museum etc... On the other hand I played a fair bit of Dwarf Fortress, and I loved the damage system with all the limbs and armor pieces. Dungeonlike is meant to be (at some point in the future) a merge of my favourite features from these games, together with all the brilliant UI solutions that exist in ToME.
Did not play Tyranny though, might need to take a look. My idea for spell customisation was based fully on my experience with Elder Scrolls 3: Morrowind, but your description of what Tyranny achieves sounds very interesting. With respect to race customisation. I recall your comment from several months back with these suggestions, got this listed somewhere in "things to consider" list (which is a huge list...).
Hit chance for spells relies on spell power, so while your spells start hitting harder, they also pierce through enemy hex resist easier (that is defined by Intelligence stat + Concentration skill). I suppose you reached a level of power which left enemy stats far behind in the dust, which might mean I need to adjust some of this, especially for enemies later in the game. I might also introduce "partial resist" mechanic, as currently such "200 dmg crush" spell like yours either hits and kills the enemy instantly, or just misses entirely. There should be something in between I feel, or some additional layers of defense against magical attacks. Otherwise all bossess will be always wiped with ease by any mage character.
I absolutely love that tanky armored mage build :D.
But killing the main boss with one hit? Poor orc. He just wanted to pillage and plunder in peace. But I guess thats what happens when you betray the horde, get a bounty on your head and attract attention of some elona-hardened wizards carrying multiple shields. He should have known better.
These are all great ideas! I think the fog of fire "kinda" exsists in the form of Wildfire spell at the moment?
And yea, there needs to be more variety and choice with respect to how melee combat is handled. Still need to figure out exactly what I want in there, but currently the open world aspect of the game is what I am mostly focusing on, and it proves to be quite a challenge.
Updated state of these items on 13/03/2018. Might need to come up with a new list soon though, as a lot has changed and other ideas have popped into my head.
I suppose it's about time I became a bit more open about where this game is going in the future and what features I have in store. Up until now I was mostly disclosing this stuff in private conversations and of course upon new version releases, but something more transparent should definitely be available, especially for those who plan to stick around for longer, especially if you can suggest any changes to what you see here or what should be here and is missing.
The Big Picture
Currently the format of Dungeonlike can be described as "one dungeon, one town, one boss to kill". Also, if you read through the story, you might get an impression that there is not much depth and that is - in a way - by design. I want Dungeonlike to eventually become an open world fantasy adventurer simulator... or something along these lines. I do not have the exact shape of that end-result in my head, mostly because I have a long list of features that in theory sound nice, but in practice they might not work well together. But details aside, open world will come at some point and a lot of work will go into the transition from current "town + dungeon" mode into "huge map with towns and dungeons" mode.
So what currently is the entire game, will at some point become a repeatable sidequest of clearing a dungeon from a location (will have some kind of bounty board for these things probably). That open world will also allow for some other activities beyond dungeon crawling, as I want to have some elements of trade and faction warfare (inspired by Mount & Blade), along with less dungeon-oriented missions, but all of these cool additional features are subject to being thrown out the the window if they become more of a pain than a source of fun. This is one of the reasons why I try to have regular updates, so that the community can have a say about any feature that is going out.
The Feature List
Here I will list all the stuff that I am currently considering, some might be half-done already. Take everything below with a grain of salt, especially if it is not really a fleshed out idea yet. I am not sure how will I manage this list over time, but I will try to keep it updated as much as I can. Here we go:
More Dungeons (Got the basics, need diversity)
Currently all you get in the game is an orcish fortress, which is ok and all, but becomes very dull early on. So I plan on having some other dungeon types that will be able to house totally different types of creatures. Now, in many roguelikes this could exist in form of branching dungeons, but if my game is going to have multiple dungeons in an open world setting anyway, it would probably make more sense to just have more than one dungeon already. I will probably achieve that by having more dungeon entrances from the Town Level for now, till I get open world up and running.
More Enemies (In progress)
This is actually quite tightly related to the "more dungeons" point and I think that this lack of variety in enemies is the main con of the game at the moment, making it a very repeatable and unsurprising. I have a ton of enemies designed on paper already, and some of them might actually make their way into the orcish fortress, before I start creating new dungeon types.
- (Got these guys now!) Tough enemies with no armor. I am thinking Ogres and maybe Trolls, but the point behind such enemy type is to make swords and axes a bit more viable as the game goes on. I have a feeling that due to armor being much less effective against blunt weaponry makes cutting weapons much less attractive. Those big beasts would actually go against this rule, as Ogre would be much easier to bleed out than to have his bones broken. These could actually appear in current dungeon, as they fit the horde quite well.
- (Got undead!) Undead. Yep, undead are definitely coming to the game and will be much much trickier to defeat than orcs. Orcs bleed, orcs run, orcs have stamina and get tired, orcs die when you remove their heads and an be poisoned. Skeletons, not really. So undead would be a much more threatening enemy group in general (as they should be!). Apart from skeletons, this would also include some zombies (and those would die when their heads are gone!), ghouls, vampires and lich-wizards.
- (In progress!) Once I get open world or some forest-like locations, I could also have some beasts and animals. Didn't put much thought into this yet, although such a body part based game is really asking for a hydra with multiple heads to be in it.
- (Might need to re-think these guys) Summoners. So this would be more of an enemy archetype that could probably be found in many variants across multiple dungeons, but that would require some AI tweaks to allow more "squad oriented" behaviour so that the summons follow their source. At that point I would probably introduce summoning spells into the game in general, so that the player can also try that.
More item enchants (In progress till eternity, can always have more and will keep adding more)
One of the things I've been thinking about was to get a new batch of enchants that can be rolled for the items, as there are many mechanics which do not get influenced by enchants at the moment: Poison-countering, Healing, Speed boost, Movement speed boost, Aiming/Spell Effect boost... and probably more. On top of that I could add some more interesting enchants, like "Massive Arming Sword" having a big bonus to damage, but a (smaller) penalty to aiming.
Rare items (Done!)
This can mean many things, but having taken a lot of inspiration for Diablo, I will have some more powerful items for the player to find, with some rarity system. Will probably have both items which are a result of multiple enchants being applied randomly, as well as some more pre-defined items which will not divert too far from some schema. Nothing too fancy, as ToME does the same thing already, but it's definitely something I want to have.
Rare enemies (Done!)
These guys will be more powerful versions of normal enemies, and will also work nicely if I am going to implement those rare items mentioned above. Best chance of getting said items would be rare enemies, and they would feel even more powerful due to the way item drops work in Dungeonlike - enemies drop the items they are using. So to get an "armor of immortality" you would first need to kill its previous owner.
Room-based dungeons (Actively developed right now )
This is a bit more in-depth kind of thing, but I think it can add a lot to the game and it is partially finished. For a long time, all enemies were spawned by placing them randomly on a finished level map. This was very sub-optimal as RNG would sometimes give you a level which mostly has empty rooms and crowded rooms, so you get odds stacked incredibly against you. Current implementation already uses the concept of a room for spawning, but I want to push that further. I want to have "themed" rooms which might have different shape (not every room needs to be a square), or some specific enemies and loot (eg. Armory room or Granary room), or maybe even be a seat for this level's captain (and that could hold rare enemies mentioned above). This could also allow stuff like trap rooms or rooms with puzzles, and of course vaults with some deadly monsters and really cool loot.
AI using consumables (Basically done, but each item needs custom logic, so this will keep getting expanded as more items come into play)
That one is pretty obious. AI does not use consumables at the moment, which is primary reason for why they don't drop consumables as well, apart from non-combat ones. I really don't like the idea of an Orc Infernalist dying due to having no mana, with a mana potion in his bag. Once I get the AI to actually use stuff like potions and scrolls, it will make way more sense for them to have those in the first place. It should also make them far more surprising, if that half-tired warrior suddenly pops a potion of vigor and starts to pummel you mercilessly.
Composite spells (Aborted. This would be a massive project, an overhaul of majority of combat system and attack structures, and a potential cause of countless bugs. Not worth it.)
The game already features a spell designer, but its functionality is quite limited. I based that entire idea off what I recall existing in TES: Morrowind, and one of the cooler things you could do with spells in there was to actually combine multiple spells into a single one to save time. This would be even more useful in a turn-based game as this one, so it's definitely a must-have. The game already expects to encounter such situation, but having this work without buggy behaviour will probably be a big adventure in coding. I think I'd rather get more dungeons and enemies first and worry about such gimmicks a bit later on.
Stealth, rogues, traps and hidden rooms (Need groundwork for that first, de-prioritised for now)
I've had this in the back of my head for a long time, and I probably get to it soon. So I already have a semi-finished visiblity system which i scrapped on the last second before release due to missing features and horrible imbalance. But the game definitely needs some sneaking mechanics. I also think that this entire area of "stealth", once introduce, will pull traps into the game, as this would be something that a rogue would be very good at detecting and countering in general. And once I get those done properly, I can also do something about all the hidden rooms that are practically impossible to find at the moment, unless you aimlessly try to "Search" from any possible position within the dungeon. And of course, once you can sneak and backstab your enemies, you can rest assured that I would already have implemented enemies who can treat you the same way.
Aggressive consumables (Actively developed right now)
To make life of the abovementioned rogues easier, I was thinking about introducing consumables which can be used directly within combat. At the moment we got semi-functional poison darts, but I was thinking about some stuff like vials of dragonfire, blinding powder, thrown knives/shurikens and so on. Maybe even scrolls which contain aggressive spells, to add even more variety. This would of course mean that the AI would also be able to use those, making combat far more unpredictable.
Item deterioration (Still not sure if it's such a good idea)
I kind of dislike the fact that once you get all the items you want, eg. all the high-tier armor, there really isn't anything to do with your gold anymore. So, in a way, you are "done". Something I am considering (but not really convinced myself) is to make items require repairs after being used for a time, so that wearing expensive armor when going into a dungeon is sort of an investment, because if things go south, the armor would require a lot of money to repair, which sucks if you went to a low-level dungeon with low rewards. This of course is taken from the perspective of open world + many dungeons, where every dungeon is an expedition, but it could work even in current setting, considering how easy it is now to just sell all loot from a given dungeon level and become rich quickly.
I was hoping that my replies would be reachable by the notification system, but apparently it just blocks all access to the "comment world" if community section is enabled, how harsh.
And no, the game is just an evening/weekend thing for me. I got a full time job as a software tester. But who knows, maybe one day... :D
If Dungeonlike crashes during gameplay or does something very fishy (like making your items disappear), let me know below. All I usually need to debug an issue is a short description of what happened just before the game went haywire, and the .log file which has been created during the crash within your game folders, under Logs. You can post your bug together with the contents of the log file here, send me a message on Facebook or shoot an email at email@example.com.
I figured that I'd much rather have an actual community/forum section under the game than a simple comment zone, especially that some of the reply chains have already become quite long and therefore difficult to read and follow with the way comments are handled on itch.io. On top of that, I really want to have a much more useful tool for stuff like development roadmaps, bug reporting, community-driven ideas and all the goodies that such a forum section can allow.
This shift unfortunately means that all comments which have been posted up till now will be hidden by the system. Not much I can do about it, I don't think I can convert them into community threads.
Nah, I got a full time job in an unrelated field (automation testing in telephony, a bit less exciting). This is just a project I fiddle around with on evenings and weekends mostly.
But you know, one day maybe :D.
This does sound serious. I could get that confirmation popup implemented quite easily now that I think about it - after any player attack/spell the game can just check if the attack is harmful and if the player is among the affected targets, then ask for confirmation. Could be optional as well, if somebody likes using AOE and does not mind hitting himself.
Elona is one of the three main inspirations for my game, ad this will get more and more visible as time goes on. Although I won't go as far as introducing etherwind and playing blackjack with a luck buff received from a loaf of bread to get potions of cure corruption, the entire idea of "fantasy sim" is on the horizon.
The particular thing you are talking about though... I didn't think about such approach. I had in mind the idea of player undergoing mutations as game progresses, but having such "custom race maker" does sound VERY interesting.
Yea, I know it's quite a bother to get all loot into the shops at the moment, but let's say - for now - that it is the price that us greedy hoarders need to pay in order to just sell everything we find :D. It's amazing (psychologically speaking) how the game suddenly feels that it "forces" you to gather and sell loot, even though it does not give you that huge of an advantage and is a totally an optional path. And yet I do find myself creating loot-chests in the middle of a level, to later take everything out of them, use Town Portal and sell all the stuff.
I do agree that for the games you've mentioned, the solutions were spot-on, but somehow I would not feel content with either (even though I love both games - Crawl was the first RL I played, while ToME was probably the one I sunk most hours into). I might go with something like "there is a special cheap scroll that lets you instantly sell all items on the ground and get 50% their worth". So if I implement some quick-selling system, it will need to have a trade-off against manual haul like that.
Yea, townsfolk are generally very crude when it comes to their AI in the first place, and I still don't have dynamic faction/attitude switching, so currently NPC's can't move their attitude towards player between allied-neutral-hostile, it's all kind of written in stone. But I didn't want to have an unpopulated ghost town just because this feature is not there yet, so there you have it, the town of defensless sheep. Enjoy your murderous tendencies while you can, Joseph the Ripper.
Sheesh, I need to start writing shorter posts. Btw, I might at some point change this comment section into a full-blown community forum (Itch.io has that option), but that will wipe all existing conversations, which I am not really happy about... :/
What version of Windows are you using? This will not run on stuff older than Vista (I tried on XP SP3 with no results). The game also needs .NET Framework 4.5 or later, so maybe that is missing (though I would expect a clear indication/error of that).
And yea, I can place them in a single folder within the archive, that is probably a clean way to do it.
Well, this does sound interesting for a project with complex shapes, but pixel-perfect is not going to be an issue in a tile based game. Getting those thousands of text lists to support the mouse will be!
Oh, I think I know what you are trying to do. You are trying to open the Dungeolike.exe itself with WinRar, aren't you?
WinRar is just a program for unpacking archives, so all you need to do now is right-click that dungeonlike.rar file and choose either "extract here" or "extract..." to make the files unacked from the archive. This will create a new folder and unpack all the files from the archive there. Then you just navigate to the Dungeonlike.exe file normally in that new folder (no need for WinRar at this point anymore) and just double click the Dungeonlike.exe file in there.
Are you trying to run the file directly, or having an issue once it is unpacked? This is a rar archive so you might need a program like WinRar or 7zip (or any equivalent) to unpack it first into a folder, then run the Dungeonlike.exe from there.
Yea, I think I managed to reproduce it by taking all the weapons off and having no spells learned and no custom attacks defined, then moving into an enemy (this brings up the attacks menu, which becomes a tiny empty box in the topleft corner - something that should be fixed as well with some "you have no usable attacks" info). If you then press Enter, the game actually tries to look up the chosen attack... and fails miserably, as nothing is chosen. I was sure I protected the window against this scenario, but apparently I didn't. What a rookie mistake.
Nice idea with variable currency amounts dictated by difficulty level, will probably do something along these lines!
Tutorial window will have the "stop asking me about this" option in next version, already got it written.
That crash looks very serious! E is just a hotkey and I've tried everything my imagination allowed me to and still could not get it to crash. Can you send me the contents of Logs folder in the game to firstname.lastname@example.org, so I can investigate?