Post by Ganbet in The Bastard of Camelot comments

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What a good text game)

Probably one of the best on itch io besides some visual novels.

Have interesting question to author - Are you watched anime Naruto?Because one kind of interaction with characters through all 3 chapters is clearly Naruto path 😁

Must admit game have really big number of choice variations , probably TOO BIG.I understand everything but choices like to change Morgana skin colour up to black, making protagonist non-binary, gay and etc is awful in context of Medieval Europe, specifically England.

Thinking "nah, everything will be fine" is like putting quadruple set of pink glasses.

Usual fantasy films , books, etc puts on Medieval time pink glasses, but that's just for entertaining reasons - i'm sure most of readers/watchers don't want to see all horrors of this certainly dark ages.

Plus it's unrealistic, if looking for education of nobles and even others , by their ancestors.

Cases happened(mostly gay) but quite rarely and often that had a bad end.But even see someone with black skin or acting like a girl (for boys*) was ridiculous.

If Morgana was black we can certainly delete this story much much earlier than Mordred was birthed.

Want to remind, i'm not against this - specifically for me no difference who has some different colour or sexuality or orientation.Human is still human, no less, no more.But we have here a fucking Medieval Ages.

*As i remember opposite for girls was considered as strange, maybe really strange but certainly not bad in begginning. Still this was up to circumstances.

P.S. If story recieves later some option literally named "Fuck the throne" it would be double shot 😆

P.P.S Honestly i not against one type of non-traditional relationships in this kind of fantasy.Yes, it's not realistic in Medieval Age setting, but hey, dragons's didn't existed in Medieval Ages ... 🙃

nullenara1 year ago(+32)(-3)

This is set in a fantasy scene that is also based the Arthurian history, yes historically it's "not correct" but this isn't based entirely on medieval times and the author is allowed to take creative liberty. I also believe the author didn't just think "nah everything will be fine" it's called being inclusive.

Ganbet1 year ago (3 edits) (+5)(-39)

"nah, everything will be fine" i meant reaction of other fictional characters on it.Like Morgana with black skin...
If that happens story even can't begin.

About creative liberty, many people somehow forget that works in both ways.If is allowed to add black people in Medieval society, especially in higher classes , so must be allowed to make a film which places somewhere in central Africa during Antiquity or Medieval Age and pictures tribe where people have white skin*.

But in similar cases when black people pictured as white many as you unhappy with that and exist special term for that.Which is kinda really strange - if you okay with this why you not okay with similar?

*Personally hate this too.And unlike many people i will hate both things, without being hypocrite and telling that one thing awesome but similar - bad.

My opinion on creative liberty in fantasy - If anyone want to make fantasy with all kind of these things just make your fantasy world or choose one where they look believable and not messing with existing original descriptions.

Itg151 year ago(+30)(-6)

You could have went with dragons, with magic, with bloodline powers, or even with the whole Camelot, since none of that really existed in Medieval Europe, but apparently it's being openly gay or black that is too unrealistic?

Not saying you are a raging bigot, but you gotta ask yourself: why exactly is that only straight white cisgender men should be allowed to be themselves in a made-up fantasy world?

Ganbet1 year ago (5 edits) (+4)(-28)

About creative liberty, many people somehow forget that works in both ways.If is allowed to add black people in Medieval society, especially in higher classes , so must be allowed to make a film which places somewhere in central Africa during Antiquity or Medieval Age and pictures tribe where people have white skin*.

But in similar cases when black people pictured as white many as you unhappy with that and exist special term for that.Which is kinda really strange - if you okay with this why you not okay with similar?

*Personally hate this too.And unlike many people i will hate both things, without being hypocrite and telling that one thing awesome but similar - bad.

"

"

Cases happened(mostly gay) but quite rarely and often that had a bad end.But even see someone with black skin or acting like a girl (for boys*) was ridiculous.

*As i remember opposite for girls was considered as strange, maybe really strange but certainly not bad in begginning. Still this was up to circumstances.

Okay, answer where i wrote where only straight white people allowed?My point is about accordance to realism.Story about Arthur and Morgana clearly take place on fantasy variation of Earth in Medieval Society that's not much different from real.Especially considering this story originally was made in Medieval Ages.

But fantasy world which haven't any relationship to Earth like Arda (Tolkin) haven't these restrictions and characters can be any skin colour, orientation or sexuality , except those who clearly was depicted in original books.

Completely own fantasy worlds haven't all kind of similar restictions at all.

P.S. Look my profile for games i played through comments which can be viewed in profile.You would be very surprised :/

P.P.S If someone depictures black as white many ppl hates him. But opposite somehow good.

Don't be hypocrites - both must be allowed or prohibited(personally prefer second option).

nullenara1 year ago (1 edit) (+12)

Sorry if it seemed like I was hating on you. I do think that if you’re wanting to play this game you shouldn’t be expecting stuff exactly out of the history book because then the author has no room for creative liberty, again I see what you mean that the creative liberty thing goes both ways. But again like I said; With the skin color options and sexuality and all of that, that’s a customization feature to make the person playing closer to the story.

Ganbet1 year ago (4 edits) (+1)(-15)

Yes, slightly, perhaps in comparison to other commentator))

Nvm, my reaction on your comment wasn't perfect too.Due to things happens in the world i quite easily getting mad on this stuff.So take my apologies too(

I understand why this was made.And that's why rated game 5 stars from beginng.

Plus obviously my comment start and ended on positive note, explanation was in neutral language.
Maybe that was not so obvious because amount of text, but i wanted to make proper explanation for my point.

Agree that make person playing closer to the story, at least it must be.But only if person doesn't bother with society.Opinion to bastards was 100% realistic but listed things much much worse in this kind of society.

Maybe problem with me, but even if this is fantasy i just can't stop using Medieval society norms when this take place on Earth and original story was made in Medieval Ages when those rules pretty much applied to the story.
If it was just modern story that takes place on Medieval fantasy Earth this wouldn't be so much problem because easy explanation - magic and all other stuff changed some things.

nullenara1 year ago(+2)

I’m glad we could clear up the misunderstanding ^^

Ganbet1 year ago (1 edit) (-19)

Wow, so many who can't read.Typical Twitter-formed generation with love of things like cancel-culture)))

What am i even expected? xD

Over the Moon1 year ago(+12)(-1)

Maybe learn how basic grammar works before whining about people not being able to read your obtuse, bigoted opinion in a public forum. Stop being a whiny little brat and go watch Naruto or something.

Devious_goblin1 year ago(+9)(-1)

Of course this dude references Naruto

Devious_goblin1 year ago(+8)(-1)

Damn, 90% of people mentioning twitter users DO just make up some guy to hate on, when that guy is just a minority of people.

That comment can just be summed up as "Kids these days"

Devious_goblin1 year ago(+12)

Dude, who cares, it's fantasy.

If there can be dragons who co-exist with people, there could be black people.

If there can be people with powers over elements, there can be gay people.

If there can be fictional places, there can be non-binary people.

Besides, gay and non-binary people DID exist in medieval times, even if not openly. Besides, wouldn't it be too restrictive to not allow choices to be gay/bi, non-binary, or black.

Not every story in the past that includes the above have to have discrimination, they don't always have to be realistic. Let gay, non-binary, and black people exist in medieval fantasy.

Ganbet1 year ago(-12)

1.About human-dragon friendship.And that was in original story.

2.Yep, and i wrote earlier that they indeed existed , but not openly.But here we can see definitely open character dialgues , like ones to Arthur.

3.At least not allow opnely gay/bi and black at all( like black Morgana).In medieval times if someone married on black, well there's Very bad news for him.

4.I wrote earlier abou it - it's certainly possible to have black, bi, gay , whatever people in medieval fantasy.But much better if it is not placed on Earth and on entirely new fictional world rather than real world and based on existing fictional story.

Devious_goblin1 year ago(+11)

1. Yes, it is in the original story, but there are many other differences between the original story and this one. In the original story, Gawain is either Mordred's brother, half brother, or cousin. While in this game, he is adopted, rather than blood-related. (though this is just one example)

2. "For the most part, any homosexual behaviour was considered sinful by medieval society, and often laws against sodomy proscribed harsh penalties such as castration and execution.

On the other hand, research has revealed that at times, same-sex relationships were tolerated and that positive depictions about homosexuality can be found in medieval literature." - https://www.medievalists.net/2011/07/same-sex-relations-in-the-middle-ages/

3. See above. Also, some people need a break from racism being attached to black characters, it is not a requirement. "Nonetheless, in the period from 500 to 1500, European writers did remark upon skin color and cultural differences, and they understood some traits to be inherited. " - https://www.aaihs.org/race-and-identity-in-medieval-europe/ (while it was true that they were still INCREDIBLY racist, remember that this is a fictional city. I, for one, am glad to have a game were I can have an openly gay, bi, or trans character without the transphobia and homophobia, I've seen enough to make me uncomfortable.

4. There have been multiple stories with POC and LGBT people based off actual fairy tales and stories, and what's the harm in that? It's re-imagining an existing piece of literature, and can be quite fun, too! By reducing the amount of characters someone can make in that re-imagining, it limits you to the same types of characters.

(Bonus!) By your logic, Mordred cannot be a woman, since women couldn't be CALLED a "knight"

"During the Middle Ages, women could not be granted the title of Knight; it was reserved for men only. However, there were many chivalric orders of knighthood that admitted women and female warriors who performed the role." - https://www.thoughtco.com/female-knights-4684775#:~:text=During%20the%20Middle%20Ages%2C%20women,warriors%20who%20performed%20the%20role.

Anyways, thanks for the challenge! It's been fun researching this type of stuff, which I've been planning to do for a while!

meIkhiresa1 year ago(+2)

I know this is 2 months old but there's a black knight of the round table in arthurian legend so what are you on about

crystalf98981 year ago

I think the difference between this and a retelling of the Arthurian Legends is that it is a fantasy immersive game. All sorts of people play these type of games, and if the point of this genre is to be immersive, then the variations ought to be big. People want to see themselves in the characters they play (this includes the family's immediate family members), it is fairly simple. Hope this helps!!

itch.io

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