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So if you're looking for mainstream games, search by suitable criteria. Why would I want to pigeonhole myself. We have tags. With descriptions. Including an artgame tag. If that's not enough, we have profiles where we can say what kind of games we make. We have collections. I just don't get what a whole new classification system is supposed to achieve except emphasize an artificial separation.

How would someone who is only used to Steam know what "suitable criteria" is? How am I meant to know what "artgame" technically means? How would the average consumer know to search for it? I feel like I already laid out the reasons I think this is necessary in the post.

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If the "average consumer" "who is only used to Steam" doesn't know what they're looking for and how to look for it, how am I as a creator supposed to classify my games for them? Never mind that such a description reads dismissive and condescending. Again, if you feel the need to make it clear that a game is intended as art, there's always the artgame tag. And maybe you could make a case for making it more prominent somehow, like it happened with the genre tags. But to divide all games in two large aisles with a row of bins between them... that just doesn't sound like Itch to me, either as a player or creator.

I mean that's the problem right now, no? I don't know how to tag my game with the tags that someone who's been convinced to give itch a go will search for, and they don't know what tags are being used to classify games other than the genres. So they click on a genre tag if they can find it, and get a jumble of games that are trying to be Video Games, half-made experiments, punk deconstructions of what a game is, and new developers' first projects, while missing any experimental things that don't really fit into the genre tags or maybe fit more into others but provide the experience they're looking for.

And again, I'm not saying there would necessarily be a big divide between These Games and Those Games, but there would be a way to signify what the game is trying to do. It would be voluntary, there's no reason a game couldn't fall under both or neither, and there's no reason the entire site would be divided into A and B. It would just be a section, or a prominently displayed tag, that neither consumers nor developers need to guess at and negotiate with each other.

Here's an example: What if I use the tag trashgame instead of artgame? What if I'm *not* making an art game, and I want to tag it as commercial? Where can I find an explanation of what artgame means if I'm new to this? Yes, it is possible for someone to come to itch for the first time and figure all of this out. It's also far easier for them to look at the front page, turn around, and buy something on sale from their steam wishlist, and that's exactly what a lot of people do.

If you need an explanation of what art game means, then how are you going to decide if the tag applies to your games or not? For what it's worth, each tag on Itch has a description (and if it doesn't, you can suggest one). And pray tell, how does game discovery work on Steam? Because from what I heard, you can find games there that don't even work. Like, at all. I'll take an artsy-fartsy game that actually runs any time.

Even in the search results, games on Itch.io have taglines and genres. I can hover the mouse over it to see screenshots. If a game sounds interesting but I'm not sure about it, I can easily click through and read more details. Including a complete list of the tags the creator thinks apply. If I'm still not sure, there's always the option to try out a demo. Often even the full game. What more can I possibly want?!

Please, PLEASE stop assuming. Stop pigeonholing people and ascribing imaginary behaviors to them. They're smarter than you give them credit for. They can search for both "art game" and "trash game" just fine. And yes, they can use both Steam and Itch.io without confusion.

1) Steam simply doesn't have the same breadth and depth of artistic - sorry, everyone seems to get stuck on that word so let's go with "noncommercial" - games as itch does. Everything on there is just to be sold. There's very little on there made to experiment with the genre or made just for its own sake. And what's this about games "actually working" here on itch more than Steam? There are games here that are hardly even built, and that's part of why the platform is great for creators. That's not a relevant point, and it's wrong.

2) Descriptions and screenshots help me decide what a game is. They don't help me wade through the hundreds of results and figure out from a glance whether something is made to be a fun few-hour adventure, or some experiment with tech or game design, some punk trashgame that's just meant to make a specific few people feel something. Most people do not spend a minute looking at each game, they scan.

3) I am not assuming, I am speaking from experience, from the experiences other people have conveyed to me, and from the fact that if I ever manage to convince someone to look at itch instead of Steam, they go back immediately. You are a moderator. Your personal experience of how you use the search and browse simply does not line up with newcomers. I've been using itch for a while and even my experience doesn't seem to line up with yours - I cannot easily find the games I want because of exactly the problem this whole thread is about. I'm not assuming, I'm not lying, I am telling you exactly what I have experienced.