Post by Juaneiro in Serenitrove comments

Viewing post in Serenitrove comments

I had played the game close to its initial release and just came back to it kind of randomly and was delighted to find it was still receiving updates. Very nice project!

I have now completed all the content (minus winning the jackpot and maxing focus levels, cause idc about that lol). I might do another playthrough rejecting the leatherworker at the start just to see how much of a difference it makes (also read in a comment you haven't had someone beat nix farfields in hard mode, so that might be an achievement to try and grab)

A couple bits of feedback from my playthrough (I restarted my save file when I came back):

-Diamonds are extremely strange in terms of progression, their rarity and pricing makes sense before farfield gets unlocked but after that they remain a strange roadblock. I forget if it was for an extra light or extra power upgrade but getting the 15 diamonds for it was such a hassle that by the time I got that particular upgrade I had enough "rarer" resources from farfields to immediately unlock the next 3 or 4 steps of progression along that upgrade line.

-Cobalt and vermillion both seem extremely abundant for how much of them you need, with copper/iron/gold/titanium I think there's a very good balance of initial scarcity, following abundance, and scarcity again once you start running low on quartz and realize they can still have some use through selling. Cobalt and vermillion suffer pretty greatly from not being sellable. Getting your first few pieces is very difficult and rewarding without farfield upgrades in general but once you get a single farfield tool you can quickly get much more than you need and it's sad to consistently ignore these initially precious metals while titanium still has some decent value.

-It would be nice if more tools had niches to fill. It's interesting that the diamond pick still has some use in the very end game, and it would be nice if other older tools still had some incentive to be present later on. Maybe even just some awkward quests for special resources needed for endgame progression or just achievements for using inappropriate tools would be nice.

-I wish power progression was a bit more spread out, currently the spike from 5(6?) to 10 just feels too extreme and while you don't actually get it all at once you spend such a comparatively long time stuck at the max level pre-farfields so once you slightly get going there you get whiplash rocketing forward. Even though the final upgrade wasn't trivial to get it also wasn't that painfully necessary to survive as the previous ones.

Overall I love this game and really appreciate the work you've put into it. My wall of feedback comes purely from a place of love <3

Scoot32 days ago(+1)

Welcome back! Thanks again for playing and for the kind words! I try to keep updating regularly to polish the game and fix any bugs. At this point though, the game feels stable and bug-free, so I've been focusing more on QoL improvements and localization.

I agree that diamonds are one of the more difficult resources to balance progression-wise. I've done several playthroughs myself, and it often comes down to rng. In some runs I get lucky with slots/treasure chests or diamond spawns, and they end up feeling almost trivial. In other runs, I've had the exact same experience you described, where diamonds become a major bottleneck and I spend a long time actively hunting for them. I'm still looking for a good solution to reduce that rng dependence, possibly some kind of exchange system. I've considered lowering diamond costs before, but I don't think that's the right approach since players with good rng would end up finding diamonds even less meaningful.

As for Cobalt and Vermilion, part of the reason they become so common is Griddle. Their spawn rates in Farfields are mainly designed around Griddle's survivability. I also try not to add too many pre-Farfields ores to Farfields, which leaves me with only two metal types to work with. But I do agree they lose a lot of their value once you've progressed a bit. I'll be adding the ability to sell Cobalt and Vermilion to Bits & Bobs in a future update, and I'm also considering introducing a third metal ore to Farfields to help balance resource distribution.

Regarding older tools, I think it's quite common for early-game gear to be phased out as stronger options become available, but I like the idea of giving them more niche uses. Special achievements tied to older tools could be fun.

For power progression after unlocking Farfields, there were two approaches I considered. The first was to continue progression at a similar pace, where training Power 7 would take as long as (or even longer than) reaching the pre-Farfields cap. The second was to treat Farfields as a new chapter, where players basically go through an early-game progression curve again, with faster initial upgrades before things become more demanding later on. I went with the second approach because I felt players would be more excited to start exploring the early Farfields layers and mechanics sooner rather than later.

Thanks so much for taking the time to write such detailed feedback. I'm always grateful when players dig into the game this deeply ;), and comments like yours are incredibly valuable for helping me improve it.

P.S. Rejecting the Tanning Rack (Hardmode) is intended more as a challenge run than a fully balanced progression path. There isn't any progression balancing built around it, so it's extremely difficult. As far as I know, nobody has beaten Hardmode Farfields with Nix yet, and I'm honestly not sure it's even possible in the current version.

Gala19 hours ago(+1)

You know Scoot, you seem to be very open to advice and cooperative so I took a chance on telling you this because I have run into devs who simply refuse to make changes, even those who admit they have had a hard time with their own game themselves. So, here goes. I have been an educator (Professor) for 22 years, and I always tell my students that having the power to change something, doesnt always mean that you have to, or that you should. It simply means, that you CAN, and therefore should.....IF the following is true: IF it is not going to harm anyone, if you yourself see a positive reason to make the change, and if you feel it will take some of the burden/stress off of others. The diamond and other rare items issue is one that many of talked about, and you admitted that you too see this. You used the word roadblock even. So as the developer you have the power to change this, and alter the rng factor some. Can you please help us out and lighten the burden a bit for the diamonds and other rare resources. The problem is that i have around 50 hours in, and have all the turtles, and other things finished basically, except the ability to get to the Farfields because I am stuck getting those items to craft the tools necessary to move along. Once you hit the obsidian area in the overworld, its a small area, but rng effects if you get past it GREATLY. Its hit or miss, and if you hit and get past it, and can move on to the water....its just to touch it and then thats it. So getting there again and really moving on is almost impossible. If we are missing something or there is a trick to it, then I would love to know. But all I see right now is the need for gear, etc, that I cant make due to the terrible RNG on most anything important. I love this game so much, and I think you are one of the best developers I have ever come across. The fact you know this game could be a huge money maker and dont put it on Steam.....deserves a Saint title lol. You could be a very rich person if you were to get this out there to the public via social media etc. And we would help you in a heart beat. So, let me know what you think, because it is possible for you to do what I am talking about. My students love your game too and have a knack for looking through files in every shape way and form to see if certain changes or factors can be made in software. Their reasons all differ a bit, but my class is one that is required for students to take to get their degrees in software security. But due to laws and more importantly, human decency and respect....I urge them to never ever make changes without the creator's permission. Afterall, it is hard to get hired by governmental agencies (they pull directly from top graduates of the University I work for), if you have are sporting a black hat in your student profile. Lol, so my point is, honesty is everything to me, and I wanted to let you know that only you have the power to make these changes. BUT they are possible, and my students were very vocal in pushing me to tell you this haha. You know kids, becoming young adults can be overly dramatic, and when they want to get their point across they sometimes do it loudly. So I am doing as they ask, and passing on their message: That they have personally found out, that it is doable and therefore you should do it because they are desperate to get to Farfields. My message to you as an adult and parent....I understand their agony lol...is please think about it, you arent obligated, though some may feel otherwise haha. Just know you are loved here at Northwestern in Chicago, IL I only choose a few devs a year, ones who Indie games are on Itch or other places that cant be seen by the masses. This is to find humble developers who choose purpose over money. You are incredible so I chose you and your game, in my lessons. It is one of those that I can use to push the students into really thinking hard, to challenge their brains, and push their personal feelings aside when frustration hits. Again, professionalism and problem solving, come before anything else, along with talent and knowledge, when working in the world. This means that dismantling code and files, rather than working through the problem at face value, (strategizing together) is not an employable, or honorable way to go about solving problems. Students who can work with your game, and ask for help, or changes to the game, without taking things into their own hands, where they shouldnt...is my goal. I really appreciate you for allowing me to teach them so much, and pushing them, and myself as well...to really think. Your updates also, have been so valuable. Thanks again.

Scoot10 hours ago

Thank you so much for such a thoughtful message! I really appreciate you taking the time to write it and your kind words honestly mean a lot to me. I'm also really happy to hear that you and your students have been enjoying Serenitrove and I'm honored that you've chosen to use it in your course.

I understand your concerns about the rare resource grind. Getting stuck because of rng isn't the kind of experience I want players to have.

I've actually just released Serenitrove v1.2.1, which lowers the Titanium Bar and Diamond costs for the Signpost. I'm hoping this helps ease that progression bottleneck and makes reaching Farfields a little bit easier.

I also really appreciate what you shared about teaching your students to respect creators and work through challenges the right way. That genuinely means a lot to me. Please thank them for their feedback as well. It made me smile hearing they were encouraging you to pass along their message :)

Thanks again for all the encouragement and for sharing your thoughts. Feedback like this really helps and I'll keep listening and improving the game as it grows.

itch.io

Viewing post in Serenitrove comments