Post by Lynn Xternal in Serenitrove comments

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Haha, you replied so fast; I was still editing my comment with more bugs! Thank you for catching bug 1 (music)

The boots bug also happens above ground, infrequently. I apologize for not mentioning that!

The furnace bug is definitely triggered with gold

Clay - Oooh, I see. I didn't realize that the update changed it; thank you =)

Bits and bobs/flares: yes, if the intent is not to have torches, then I understand, but this makes reaching the water impossible in vegan mode. Not only due to the lack of health, but also due to no flares/no torches making optimal restore cell pathfinding impossible (the strat for standard mode is to use one mageflare rune for every seven depth to get to water, esp with grampshell). Perhaps this needs rebalancing for vegan mode so it's hard but not impossible.

I mentioned a few more bugs in my comment above before I saw your reply; I hope you see those too!

Thank you so much for your fast reply!

Scoot242 days ago(+1)

Thanks to your bug reports and feedback, I've managed to fix most of the issues mentioned! I tried equipping and un-equipping footwear on the surface multiple times, and it didn’t trigger issue #3. The rest should all be fixed now :)

Regarding the difficulty of Vegan mode not having a light source: that actually wasn't the original plan. The initial idea was just to remove leatherworking, but since backpacks require leather, one thing led to another and I ended up rolling with it.

Now that I've had more time to think about it, the implications are a bit too heavy. I'm planning to introduce an alternate way to craft backpacks. Probably by allowing sheep to spawn during vegan runs, so they can be sheared for Wool (a new resource). That way, players could craft a different type of backpack using wool, enabling a different playstyle without making things impossibly hard.

Though technically, with wool involved, it might no longer qualify as a true "Vegan" run (maybe we'll call it a "Pacifist" run instead or something along those lines).

Lynn Xternal242 days ago (2 edits)

Thank you so much for patching these so quickly!!

If you don't mind my weighing in, I really like the idea of a "vegan" mode; it's one of my favorite things about this game (lifelong vegan IRL). I especially love how poetic it is that the vegan mode is the hard mode, haha. I'd be a little bit sad to see this go; some good alternatives to wool are hemp (jute) or flax (linen) fleece. However, I already love the game, and I'd still be excited no matter where you take it!

As of now, without leather, there is no flask or footwear, which alone adds plenty of new gameplay options. Without a backpack for flares/torches is like an "ironman" mode, and I also like that challenge too.

With that in mind, I love the idea of having the flares and torches be in a non-leather backpack, and having a flask and boots in the leather inventory, would fit in and enable three gameplay options: full ironman mode (with no leather/torches/flares), leather-free mode (no boots/flask but with torches/flares), and standard mode (with everything).

I'm curious to hear your thoughts!

Scoot241 days ago(+1)

Thanks for the kind words and all the thoughtful input, it really means a lot :)

The sheep and wool idea is still very much in the brainstorming phase. There aren't any solid plans for changes to vegan/hardmode just yet. Right now, my main focus is still on polishing and expanding the standard mode. So for the time being, vegan mode will stay as-is (no backpack, no flask, no torch, no footwear).

That said, I absolutely love hearing your perspective, especially knowing you're a lifelong vegan! Your suggestions around alternative materials like hemp or flax are super interesting, and I really appreciate how you've broken down the different potential playstyles.

One idea I've been toying with is maybe having Bits and Bobs sell a simple cloth version of the backpack directly. Something with fewer slots (maybe just two) as a middle-ground option.

Once the core game is in a more complete state, I'd love to revisit vegan/hardmode and explore ways to make it a distinct and challenging experience without being too punishing.

Thanks again for taking the time to share your thoughts!

Lynn Xternal234 days ago

I know hard mode isn't on the radar for now, but what are your thoughts on introducing Bits and Bobs in hard mode, just for the purpose of selling ore? Thoughts on selling gold ore?

Scoot234 days ago(+1)

Actually, Bits and Bobs was never intended to be removed from hard mode. It was originally set to unlock only once the player had purchased the backpack (since the Torch requires a backpack slot). In hard mode, where there's no backpack available, that meant Bits and Bobs didn't unlock. Now that we have ore exchange available there and not just consumable sales, it makes sense to adjust things. I'll be removing the backpack requirement for unlocking Bits and Bobs, and instead, I'll have the Torch simply show or hide depending on whether you have a backpack.

As for selling gold ore, that is definitely planned (and even titanium once future ores are introduced, hint hint). I'll be rolling gold and titanium ore exchange out gradually though, once older players have had time to stock up a bit more.

Lynn Xternal234 days ago

Oh thank you so much! I have 999 iron and copper ore, so this will make those useful again. I'm glad there's a lot more on the radar =)

Thoughts on selling bars/gems? I also have near-maxout numbers of bars and hundreds of gems, even after the recent updates...

Scoot234 days ago

I'm really glad you are finding the exchange useful.

Bar selling will not be implemented, since bars are not considered raw materials and players can already sell ores instead. This also helps avoid cluttering the Bits and Bobs items menu. As for gems, selling them might be added in the future, but not for now. Gems are treated as rare materials, and I want to avoid a situation where players sell them off, only for a new item or mechanic to arrive that needs them, that would be really frustrating.

That said, it is normal for resources to eventually fill up over time. Even with the exchange system, there will come a point when materials like quartz (and others) will hit their limits too. In a way, that just means you love the game a lot, and I'm super thankful for that :)

Lynn Xternal241 days ago

New bug, at least in hard mode: Switching to Caelo sometimes doesn't change the light radius, but collecting a gem or switching gear while underground will cause the light radius to be correct.

Scoot240 days ago(+1)

It looks like the bug was tied to how the light radius was being calculated during character changes. It should be fixed now, thanks again!

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