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Balance Musings - Warriors

A topic by PurpleSparrow created Nov 21, 2023 Views: 730 Replies: 32
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I know balance work is on-going. I've won with DEX and INT builds but I think it is really hard to win with STR builds. Too many late-game enemies have retributive damage shields, you can't use area attacks against summons, and you miss the many (beneficial) passives from the spell chains (notably gas immunity) unless you dip outside your competency.  

Interesting, I find melee to be the strongest classes right now, warrior and barb are so powerful.

Have you ever won with barbarian or warrior without at least 12 in both Dex and Int? (not that I don't think that multiclassing should be a thing but your no longe truly a fighter once you add INT into your build, you're more of an arcane knight or something)

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All classes always take multiple different attributes, that is not what I would call multiclassing. I go 14 str for talents, ~4sp, then int for more damage. As I don't full clear, that is usually around 12ish int, depending on the items I get. For talents, I stick mostly to the base talents, picking up a few barbarian melee abilities. I don't take spells on melee (not that it would be bad), and only occasionally take a passive (shroud of wind for the levitation, stealth mastery). I also don't take duelist abilities on anything other than duelist, as I like the game to not be completely free (I think duelist is absolutely OP).

Here is a typical warrior build for me: https://imgur.com/a/QiPxdbs

And a barbarian build: https://imgur.com/a/DgZvzeA

Warrior run from today - I get int just for the extra damage on the melee abilities:

Granted! I stand corrected.

Oops I just understood the "I also don't take duelist abilities on anything other than duelist" I should have posted this on it's own thread, sorry.

Oh, but duelist is undoubtably better then either of these IMO.

Add power (though it's just been nerfed so we'll see) to disengage + lunge LVL 2 and you can trivialize most fights (including Yendor).

This was admittedly before race removal but with that power potion I managed to kill both the goblet and Yendor within 1 turn. 

Also please don't judge me this was significantly earlier into my Rouge fable IV career.

Adds melee damage then doubles it with ability power. Killed the boss and all his minions in one turn with 1 SP (before power nerf)

Even nerfed power is still super strong, same for duellist, strongest class right now imo.

 I would agree with PurpleSparrow I've only ever had success with warrior when adding aura of death and lunge to my build.

I've never been a fan of aura of death, still don't think its worth it even with gas immunity being added.

+3 hp per rat kill? In sewers? (also with toxic damage surpassing protection and toxic resistance working properly it can turn an extreamly dangerous branch for an armour reliant class into a relatively easy trip to a hopefull harpoon.

Though I suppose it loses it's much of it's worth once your stuck with Ice caves+ Iron forge (and in many boss fights)

There us so much healing from shrooms that extra hp from lifetap does very little. I don't see any class as being armor reliant, armor is trash, better to not get hit. Would much rather spend the talent points on things that will help me kill all the yendors.

Fair

I tried 4 times .  Str 16 Dex 10 Int 10 .  I still have 24X gold (can buy 3 Dex ).

ver 0.21

Rogue class but warrior + barbarian skills. I love that ignore damage shields Gloves.

That hurts to see, all the good rogue skills ignored :(

Sorry,not fan of these skills.

Give shadow step with melee a go :)

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I prefer charge . melee damage / AoE with axe& spear / less cooldown

Shadowstep and doesn't take a turn, and has greater range/utility. They are not exclusive, take both for even more fun.

I don't need two displacement skills.Charge and 7 speed points are good enough.Even though Shadow step doesn't take a turn, I still need other actions to kill the monster.I prefer extra damage or extra AoE.Shadow step is not worth two talent points to me.

I only put in 1 point. The ability to go over walls and through monsters, to extremely freely reposition is just so useful. Can escape from being grabbed, get out if you go too deep. Can never have enough movement.  I like how it leaves all your SP for fine manoeuvring instead of any gap close, no need to waste turns waiting for charge.

Play whatever you like, just a recommendation for even more fun :)

It hurts to see shroud of wind not used to it's full potential

Int 10.  Shroud of wind can't level up .

After quite a few tries I managed to snag a win with a dexterity, intelligence, and strength character.  I definitely found it easiest to win with the ranger as they have high dps, good crowd control, and incentives to build up a big pool of speed points. Especially they had an easier time with the first few levels (I find that I most commonly die on level 2 to normal battles with frogs or bees, then my character powers up and the 3rd dungeon and side dungeons are easier).


I found the recent change that makes the tome of knowledge grant you a free point in the skill made the game a lot more manageable, as you could afford to spec up in both your offensive skills and passive/mobility skills.


All in all this is a very good and addictive game - at first it seemed impossible but after learning the mechanics and some basic builds it becomes very doable.


PS: the comments above about the duelist being overpowered are a little bit hard for me to believe - I struggle getting past the first couple dungeons without any crowd control or ranged attacks. Maybe they require a higher skill floor.

The duelist abilities previously had much, much higher bonus damage, it got nerfed.

If you find a ranged weapon early game becomes simple on duelist, its easy to get things into kill range of disengage. If you don't, disengage 2 is still very good at kiting back from fights. Disengage/step back lets you move pretty far, using the terrain to your advantage. A key thing against frogs is to use unstable terrain to get the kills to keep your SP. Sometimes, taking a hit to use a normal attack is worth it, to bring them into kill range for disengage.

Yeah, that's what I like about this game - it goes from impossible to 100% win rate all depending on player skill, not grinding some levels.