## Cherkov

28
Posts
8
Topics
A member registered Jul 25, 2016

### Recent community posts

That is a great explanation of the Deform formula. I have some questions about x, y and z though. Delta is the change in direction. So I figure Size is the size of the shape in x, y, or z direction? Or is it the size of the sine wave? Pivot seem like the origin point of the sin wave maybe, so 0.5 would be the middle of the shape in whatever direction. I can't figure out what the x, y, z is in the parts like sin( _ * x + _). Is it the movement of the sine wave in that direction on the particular plane?

Sorry for all of the questions. I never got far in math. I'm trying to brush up on my sohcahtoa.

(Edited 1 time)

I was just saying how I wish I knew how to use the tools better. I know Merge and Delete are Shape mode, and Create is Tile mode :P

The Deform tool is something I am trying to get to grips with. I'd like to know how you got those windows in. It looks like you took the building shape and cloned it and then deformed it, but I'm sure there's more to it than that.

There is one problem from a gameplay point of view. There is a guy that occasionally pops out of the windows to throw flower pots at the fighters, and a lady that throws confetti at the winner. It would be cool to get the window to "open" when they appear. That seems like it would require scripting to read memory and deform the window accordingly.

Setting the restriction to 1 fixed the building immediately. That's one function I haven't played around with much. I though the numbers represented pixels, so it's good to know it's really tiles. I must have missed that part in the manual.

Thanks for explaining how the backend stuff works.  It really helps when editing. I've read through the manual and managed the basics with some trial and error. I would love to say I completely understand, but I'm not there yet. I wish I had a better grasp on the more advanced tools, like Merge, Delete, and Create in tile mode.

There is a shimmering effect when zooming or moving the camera. It only happens when the graphics quality is set to medium or high, so it might have something to do with the shadows. It looks like some sort of moire pattern. Here is a video of it happening during zoom.

Shimmering pattern

I ran into this problem while working on Urban Champion. There was a piece of a foreground building that the program recognized as part of the city skyline. I was able to get it separated using the delete button, but that messed up the city skyline on other screens. When I tried to restore those pieces back to how I wanted, the original piece I wanted as the foreground building became part of the city skyline again.

Here is a picture of the offending piece.

And here is how it look in the texture editor.

With a little searching, I eventually found the part of the texture used to draw that part of the shape., but when it was changed, it ended up changing more than I wanted.

The other problem I had was trying to add a window texture to the buildings display windows. Originally, I was going to use the clone tool and add another piece as the glass, but when I tried using the texture tool, the results were not ideal. Here is a picture of the window and its texture.

And here is how it looks when filled in.

Now I still could have made this work by cloning another piece and scaling it down and offsetting it, but wasn't prepared to spend that much time.

(Edited 3 times)

The infamous Urban Champion in 3D! Worked on this one for a little while. It's still not 100% how I'd like it, but it's not bad overall.

3dn

Video

Edit: Updated 3dn file

Works great! You are amazing! You even fixed a little graphical bug I chalked up to emulation, where one frame of the little fireball enemy in Donkey Kong was missing the bottom half of the sprite, but only when moving right.  You can see it in the video I posted in the repository. Thanks.

It no longer causes it to hang, but it does give the following error - "An item with the same key has already been added." - and all the 3dshapes revert back to their default settings losing all of the edits that were made.

The steps taken were:

Open 3DNes.

Click on the item to edit. In this case, I chose a rolling barrel that had SizeZ set to a different value than the rest of the frames. It is set to 12 while the rest are 10.

I adjusted the SizeZ value from 12 to 10.

Saved the 3dn.

Exit 3DNes.

Reopen 3DNes.

That's when the error occurs.

Let me know if you have any luck. I have another one doing it as well.

Here is the broken one

And here is the backup

There was a problem with a 3dn I was working on. It was causing the emulator to hang when I tried to load it. I could load the backup file, but when I made any changes to it and saved, it would cause a hang next time it was loaded.

(Edited 5 times)

Here is an updated version of this file. I had to redo it all from the start, but it should not cause the emulator to hang anymore. Let me know if this works.

Donkey Kong (U) (PRG1) [!].3dn

Video

It's looking so good. It really has come a long way.  Keep it up!

You're right. You can still select it by clicking, but I find it easier using the nav buttons. It can be difficult to select the missing sprite if there's another sprite right behind it. At least I had that problem with River City Ransom a few times.

If you accidently set something to zero, use the Nav buttons to get back to the sprite since you can no longer click on it. I've had it happen quite a few times, so I know how frustrating it is.

No. This is majorly messed up. Scrambled character sprites and weird looking backgrounds. The text comes through fine though.

There are other games that do that for me as well. I just assumed it was like that for everyone.

So playing around with it some more, I'm wondering if it has to do with color palettes. Since sprites are only allowed 4 colors, or 3 and a transparent color, they seem to be using this sprite to add a 5th color to the main sprite. I don't know why that would cause an issue with the patterns, but that's my thinking so far.

Looks good so far. The first village is a mess for me. Is it that way for you too? I'm assuming it's just an emulator issue, but I hope it's not my PC!

I forget exactly when, but it was while digging, as opposed to just walking through tunnels already dug, since that is when he pulls out the shovel. It might have been just one frame where I was digging a specific direction like up or down.

With things like those, I set the depth of one to be a little higher or lower or even a different layer depending on which one I want showing, otherwise, if you set the faces to the same depth, you end up with Z fighting.

I gave it a try but couldn't get it to work. First I set the sprite to 0 and then changed the other sprite to cylinder. No luck.

So then I tried setting the sprite to 0, saving and exiting the emulator, reloading, and then changing the other sprite to cylinder. The thinking being that maybe some variable or flag was being stored by the software that could be cleared by reloading. Again no luck.

Finally, I renamed the .3dn file and started with a fresh one thinking maybe the file was storing a value. No luck there either.

I tried in multiple different spots where I know the problem exists but couldn't get it to work. I even found that the sprite serves another role by being pieced together to form giant letters in one instance. Parts of the letters were missing when I set the sprite to zero.

Here's another thing. I must be wrong about it being just overlap because sprites overlap all the time in these games and it has never been a problem, but also I found a spot where that sprite didn't make this happen as well. I'm going to play around with it some more and see if I can find out anything else.

Now that I know, I have noticed it more in other games, too. Urban Champion and Dig Dug were some I was playing with and I can reproduce it pretty easily. It definitely is happening during sprite overlap.

There were 2 rectangle sprites I noticed. The brown one is Dig Dug's shovel and the red one is his pump. If you look closely at the Dig Dug sprite when he is digging or pumping, you'll notice a little cutout in it. On a regular NES, the rectangles would be drawn behind the Dig Dug sprite and the color would only be seen through the cutout, if that makes sense. They use that technique in other games as well, though I'm not sure why.

(Edited 2 times)

I worked on this one for a little bit. There is still some minor pop in that needs some work and I barely made it through the first level, but hey, it's something. Next time I'll have to use the Konani code. Hope you like it.

Pattern preset hotkeys sounds great, but will they be user definable? Each game can need its own settings to get a good effect and I think hard coded values might be a problem.

If you can do that with animated sprites, that would be better than good, that would be amazing! As long as the user still has some control over it, that's cool.

Do you have a feature list of what's being worked on and what is planned for later updates? I don't want to keep bugging you with things that you are already addressing.

After spending some time editing, I thought of a new feature that would be helpful. It would be cool to have some sort of palette with different presets you could apply to the currently selected sprite. You could set all of the values for the setting (depth, scale, layer, and pattern), and then give that setting an appropriate name, like Text, Background, Pick-up, or Enemy. Then whenever you come across a sprite that should have those settings, you just press the right button and they get applied.

This would help when editing animations. Each time the animation changes to a new frame, sometimes all of the settings will change as well. Then you have to go through and adjust each setting by hand again, hit the Adjust button, and then do it again for the next frame.

It would also help when editing large sprites that are made up of separate groups or game with complex backgrounds that you want to have a consistent feel.

Finally, an undo button would be nice. It drives me crazy when I accidentally hit Delete. That might just be me though.

Punch Out Glitch

I put it in my dropbox. Watching it again, it seems to only happen to the cylinders and cubes. I also noticed it while playing Urban Champion just now. It seems to be that when 2 sprites occupy the same spot and you try to change one to a cube/cylinder, the 8x8 tile of the sprite you are changing disappears. In the Punch-Out video, there is a white sprite that you can't really see because of the see through effect you get while editing. But it would be in the same spot as the sprite that keeps disappearing.

No problem. I am having a lot of fun with this.

There is another bug I noticed in Punch-Out. Sometimes when changing the pattern on a character sprite, one part of it will just disappear. If you delete the sprite, it will come back, but only to disappear again if you edit it. It happens most often with the faces of characters. It seems to have something to do with this white sprite block the developers put behind the character faces occasionally to make the eyes and/or mouth white. I have a video of it if you need to see it.

I also wasn't sure if it was okay to put up a video of Punch-Out since it is glitchy right now.

(Edited 3 times)

This on has been very time consuming. I have only gotten past Von Kaiser so far. Trying to get all of the possible different animations for the fighters has been a challenge. Let me know if you find any I missed so far.

There are some odd graphical glitches going on, mainly with the before match character portraits and the animation for when you get a star. I'm not sure what the problem is...

Update: Done up to most of King Hippo now

(Edited 2 times)

Here is a little bit o' Arkanoid. Edited up to level 16 using level skip. It should be all that is needed.

Video

(Edited 2 times)

I accidentally deleted the original post for this, so here it goes again.

This is a work in progress. The video shows some of the struggles with menus. Enjoy!

@mrgame131 Being able to record and playback would be amazing, but I'll take save/load, too.

I hope you can reach that vision. It is very cool to hear that your idea is to make this a general tool for any type of 2D game/console. That will be amazing to see! I don't know if you are familiar with programs like Sprite Lamp, or SpriteIlluminator, but they are used to create normal maps for 2D sprite based games. Where those just allow better 3D lighting of 2D sprites, 3DNes gives real depth to the them allowing you to move around them. Its awesome!

Anyways, when I mentioned the sphere shape, I forgot to say that the cylinder shapes make good spheres themselves, but the problem is that they can appear hollow when viewed at different angles. If there was an option to have a filled cylinder instead, that might cover the need to have a sphere shape.

My only concern with the emulator functions coming second is that it can make editing 3D difficult. You need to be more than just good at playing a game. You need to be good at playing a game while editing it as well. Some people just want to play, so making it easier for others to create premade .3dn files for players to use will only benefit 3DNes in the long run. Common emulator functions like save states, or recording and playback could help with that.

You are probably right about the Mario cloud thing. I have no idea what an NES does at a technical level. ;)

Now I have to create an account somewhere to host the .3dn files I have been working on. Any suggestions? I'm pretty new to this.

(Edited 2 times)

First off, thank you very much for this new emulator experience. It has breathed new life into these old classics. The real impressive part to me is how well the program is able to guess alot of the layout on it's own.

I have a lot to say so forgive me if I ramble a little.

More shapes:

I think a lot of users would agree that this is an area that needs expansion. What you have is a good start, but more variety would be welcome. Spheres, pyramids, half-shapes like half-cylinders or half-spheres.

Custom Shapes:

Even better than more shapes would be custom shapes. An editor to create or add your own shapes would allow better customization for games using less traditional side-on views.

Z Position:

We already have Z depth and Z scale, but it would also be nice to be able to set Z position, as well. The layer system kind of already handles this, but having just a front and back layer can feel too restrictive. Sometimes it can be difficult to get HUD elements to not be obstructed by level or character sprites. I don't know how big of a value would be needed. 0-255? Would 256 levels of depth be enough?

Sprite Groups:

While the emulator does a good job of grouping up sprites that belong together, it can sometimes make mistakes. The delete tool can help, but even that doesn't work, or causes more problems. Some examples are in Bionic Commando, some text sprites in the demo screen would get attached to a background sprite and deleting did nothing to help. In Spelunker, when trying to group the ground tiles together, every time I deleted some, it would effect others that I already fixed that I didn't select. Also Punch-Out is a good example since it has such large character sprites. Editing can give strange results because of the way the emulator decides to group them together.

I don't know how difficult it would be to implement, but a way to control what sprites are grouped together would be very helpful. Even being able to see how the program decides what is grouped together or what sprites are associated with each other would be nice. That way when you are editing, you know what will be affected by any changes you make. Of course that only works for whatever you can currently see on screen...

That's about all I have for requests for now. One other thing I noticed is that when setting objects to the background layer, setting their depth only seems to make it the depth go further back into the background. For example, if I have 2 objects set to the background layer, one with a depth of 8, the other with a depth of 32, the front face of both objects will be on the same plane and only the backs will be different - 8 and 32 respectively. Shouldn't it be the other way around so that the front of the objects stick out from the background at different depths? I can get that effect by fiddling with depth and Z scale, but it just seems overly complicated.

Another thing, like some others people have commented before, I thought it would be cool to have a sprite sheet option so that we could edit sprites directly from them. But then I realized why that is not possible. Take Super Mario Bros. for example. A classic bit of trivia and clever programming is how they used the bush sprites as cloud sprites or vice versa. You couldn't edit that one sprites values since it is used as 2 different objects unless you don't mind them appearing exactly the same.

Lastly, I would like to know what plans you have for expanding this emulator yourself. What is your vision for it beyond what it currently is?