oh my god i haven't finished chapter 3 yet (will comment over there when i do) and also don't want to spoil for people who might read this but holy SHIT am i going to live on the high of knowing i asked such a relevant question (albeit completely unknowingly) for a very long time LMAO props to you for answering it so gracefully!!!
oh wow, i randomly decided to look you up because i was in a nostalgic aloners mood and this was an absolute TREAT of a surprise!!! i love this fucking disaster of a demon so much already, i cannot WAIT to keep blowing his mind by being nice to him and not putting up with his self-deprecating shit >:) looking forward to june (and if it takes longer, that's okay!), super curious to see where the business with J will go and also how flea's gonna come back to the mc from that argument once he's cooled off bc jesus, dude, i almost got hurt for real, he sure knows how to hit where it hurts! absolutely delicious >:)
also, out of curiosity, can demons change their appearance, besides the chimera thing? like, does flea deliberately look like he's in his mid-30's (or its demonic equivalent, i suppose, should they age differently), or is it a reflection of his actual age?
Hi there! It didn't come across as rude at all, please don't worry about it! A quick disclaimer before I reply, though - I do not have PTSD nor any sort of psychological training, so I do not feel I have any authority to decide if what the MC feels or thinks is a clear consequence or symptom of PTSD. All I have are theories based off how I have heard other people describe their experiences, and I would very much like to hear the opinion of a person who has PTSD regarding this topic.
Another disclaimer - while I said the explanation that the MC has PTSD or shock is valid, I wanted to make it clear that I did not. personally, interpret the MC's reactions and thoughts as them having PTSD. Like I said, I think it'd be a valid explanation but it is not the one that I would personally use.
Now since that's out of the way...
In my opinion, the MC probably has a very, very low sense of self-worth. I personally interpret their joking as a coping mechanism since it's something that I recognise in myself, but it's not a perfect explanation since, as you mentioned, the MC seemed pretty quick to forgive (which is definitely not something I would have done in that situation). They seem almost incapable of taking offense when someone yells at them undeservedly or treats them like crap - which is something I can see being a consequence of the way they were raised. A royal without any relevant opinions and used only as a pawn in political schemes.
The quickest way to diminish someone's power is to laugh about it. In my mind, joking around with Damon was a way of trying to make him think the MC hadn't been affected by his behaviour. Joking around with Bash and Aya were a way to 1. distract themselves and 2. put up a strong front. Nothing screams strength quite like a smile, I think. The trick is not letting people see it's fake. I just wish we could have seen more of the MC's thought process.
I like the interpretation that you and harmonia5 were talking about above where the MC might be trying to protect themselves in a hostile situation. Again, I still think that should have reflected on the MC's internal dialogue, but I suppose the writers meant for us to insert our own explanation for each of our MCs' actions.
Another point for me personally is that I'm a HUGE people pleaser. I can't stand the idea of being disliked and I can (through some self-projection lol) see the MC being the same, especially when they're so used to being irrelevant their entire life. It could even be a combination of both - the MC is trying to make Damon like them both because he's one of the few people they (kinda) have, but also because if he likes them he won't want to sell them out again.
I whole-heartedly agree with you on the Vexx angle. Based off what they just found out, the MC definitely should have a ton of trust issues. However, I don't have any personal experience with betrayal from a loved one (something I'm very thankful for) and have honestly no idea how long it would take for the trust issues to set in. Is it something that builds up when you're betrayed again and again, or is it immediate? Not specifically aimed at you, I'm mostly musing for myself.
Actually, the more I think about it the more I agree with you. I don't know much about PTSD symptoms besides what you've just mentioned, and it does become stranger and stranger that the MC would react so tamely to Damon even if they had PTSD. But again, is PTSD something that sets in immediately or only after some time has passed? The MC hasn't exactly had much time to process everything - it's probably not even been 24 hours since they saw Vexx.
I think the shock thing is more with the MC being numb, which is something I can get behind. Even the emotional responses are quite tame (then again, I can be quite emotional but dislike breaking down in front of people so it could be that for the MC as well), so in my mind everything hasn't really dawned on MC yet. Not even the full implications of Damon's suggestion. For now, they seem to be satisfied that Damon won't sell them off just yet, but I hope the realisation can hit them like a brick in the next episode or so. I've mentioned this before, but I really, really hope we can run away on Cursa.
So to summarize, I think the MC's reactions had more to do with numbness and low self-worth than PTSD. I think numbness is a part of shock?
I'm sorry for taking a while to reply (uni might be cancelled but their assignments are not :( ) and for maybe not answering your questions in a satisfactory way. I found myself agreeing with you the more I thought about it, haha
Maybe your chance will still come, the patch notes say that the MC will really have a chance to form their personality from Ep 4 and onwards haha
I do hope the MC can grow out of their innocence if they choose to, it'd be really fun to replay and try out different personalities and endings. I probably won't, because I'm a coward and a softie who usually sticks to replaying and swooning over the same thing over and over once she's found what she likes, but it'd be nice to have the option lol
Go forth and fulfill all your revenge dreams, my friend!
Hey, I know this wasn't aimed at me and while I cannot say what EvilChani meant for sure, I don't think they meant to call you, specifically, a pathetic wretch. It might have been poorly put, but I think the sentiment was more along the lines that an MC who, if they don't have any mental illnesses or psychological issues, just takes that kind of treatment without even defending themselves needs to learn their own worth and not let people walk over them like that.
You say, and I'm copypasting, "I'm demure irl, despite my own psychological issues". I'm interpreting that as meaning you do have psychological issues (I apologise if I'm incorrect). In this case, I don't believe EvilChani is including you in the "pathetic wretch" statement. I think it's unfair to assume they're ableist or that they have a "hoedown gun bearing hyper-aggressive personality", especially when in another comment they've mentioned that anger is a defense mechanism for them. I don't know if they have any mental illnesses or psychological issues of their own and neither do you.
I don't think having a demure personality is a bad thing. If I had been in the MC's shoes, I'd probably have taken it all without snapping at anyone, too (maybe a wisecrack or two, but that's my personal defense mechanism). We are all different, and the discussion surrounding "the best way to react to how the MC is treated" is a highly subjective matter.
Could EvilChani have worded it better? Perhaps, but it's no reason to become passive-aggressive. Please let's be respectful of each other here, none of us know what is truly going on in other people's minds.
I apologise for butting in when it's not my discussion to have, but I'd rather try to mediate things than letting them escalate further. I suppose that's MY personality. If either of you feel I have stepped out of line, feel free to ignore me and go at each other's throats. Just please be aware of the old cliché that everyone is fighting their own battle.
If my assumption that you have psychological issues are correct, I hope you find healing. From one mentally ill person to another.
My theory is that his assholery might have something to do with being Kitalphan. Aya doesn't pull any punches when telling the MC about what happened to the planet, and while she says that most Kitalphans are over it I can't help but wonder how the hell you get over the destruction of your entire planet, killing 90% of your people because the monarch wanted to make some profit. It'd make sense for Vexx to hold a grudge over that, I'd even understand it (not that it excuses manipulating the MC into leading their entire family into being murdered).
I agree that this is only the third episode and many things can change, but then again I'm worried about Vexx's route. I cannot stress enough how much I love love LOVE redemption arcs, but they have to be earned in proportion to the crime, and Vexx's actions are borderline unforgivable. I'm not the resenting sort, I can forgive most things, easier than I probably should, but there has to be a proper build up. A tragic backstory and a half-hearted apology (because I don't think Vexx would ever fully regret the assassination of the king who had his entire planet destroyed, even if he regretted the MC's involvement and his role in it) wouldn't be enough for me, personally. I'm pretty sure there'll be more reveals about just how deep King Fenris' corruption truly ran, and while his death alone is, for me, already justified, I cannot get behind the assassination of an entire family. Unless they were involved in the corruption instead of just benefiting from it, I don't buy it.
I'm not trying to argue with you, I fully agree that every action from every character has a reason that is, if not justified, completely understandable. I'm honestly just bouncing off thoughts, trying to make sense of what we've seen so far. I really, really like Vexx as a character, and I like Damon too. Their respective dynamics with the MC are very important to the story, everyone's dynamics are. I'm just hesitant to forgive their actions unless there's a proper build up, not just a sad past.
I want to have faith but redemption arcs are easy to botch up, especially when it comes to good-looking, white male characters. They can get away with a lot more shit than female characters and characters of color can. Again, my intention is not to argue - I'm just vocalizing my thoughts. My apologies for using your comment as a jumping board to get into my own opinions.
Thank you so much for listening to our wishes and opinions! I love that we have the option to skip some of the background stories, it adds a lot more replayability. I'm honestly floored that you'd be so caring about your players as to make a patch just five days after the episode was released! You guys are amazing, thank you so much for the work you put into this!
Yeah, I remember seeing something about locking our routes in Ep 5, too. God, I hope Damon's route doesn't involve the MC going "ah i'm so attracted to him despite all he has done uwu guess i still care about him despite everything, he just had a rough past so it's understandable uwu". I'm with you in that Damon probably can't change enough in just two chapters, so I'm guessing maybe the devs might go with something along the lines of him not truly meaning it?? Despite him claiming he did?? Idk dude, he dug himself into a deep, deep hole. I just read the update and wow, he's even more of a dick than I thought. I really am curious to see how the writers are going to salvage his route.
June's scene hurt like fuck, in my humble June-mancer opinion. I truly expected him to be ready to beat Damon up when the latter suggested selling the MC out and was sucker punched when he wouldn't even meet the MC's eyes (even though it made sense later).
I loved Calderon's scene! I saw some comments about it feeling OOC but it felt pretty accurate to what we saw so far, he strikes me as the type of guy who can recognise when he's in the wrong and not let his pride get in the way of apologising. He seems like he'd understand the MC bidding everyone adieu though, even if he'd curse the shit out of them when he finds them again.
There's one thing I don't get, though? I don't understand why Ryona is being painted as just as bad as the rest of the crew? Not necessarily by you, but I noticed it as a trend in the comments - most people seem to be saying the entire crew shat on the MC? To me, Ryona felt like the only one besides Cal who really didn't let the MC's past get between them. Maybe I didn't read her scene carefully enough, but I don't remember her having any beef with the royal family? I'm genuinely wondering, please inform me if I'm off my rocker about this.
God, I hope we can run off in Cursa. It'd be the best way to make the chosen love interest actually try making it up to the MC.
So I just played the updated version (thanks for cluing me in on that, I had missed it completely!) and wow do I have thoughts on it.
I'm with you on the Vexx thing, I still don't know how he could be redeemed at all. Mind you, I'll still try his route out because I'm holding out on the hope that he'll break down in guilt (something I deeply enjoy seeing) at some point but that's hardly enough redemption for all the shit he pulled. The more you think about it, the more sickening it gets - I used the flirtation options during the flashback just for the added angst upon the reveal (also because it makes sense for my particular MC to fall for him during her time at the palace) and I can't stop wondering what's going through his head whenever the MC flirts with him. When he asks the MC "Are you mine?" the second time we flirt, and the MC nods. Does he get some sort of sadistic satisfaction, knowing that he's got the youngest royal wrapped around his pinky finger? If the MC had died, would he see seducing them as an achievement, something to brag about among the other revolutionaries? The ultimate notch on his bedpost? I kinda want to write something about it, just to explore how fucked up he might truly be.
Then again, he did have some pretty heavy tsundere undertones (like how he almost showed concern before putting on a mask of coldness and bitterness again), so I suppose it all might just be a ploy of "he didn't mean it he's just trying to push the mc away bc he doesn't want to admit he likes them uwu". Which... makes sense? I guess? I understand that way of thinking, but it would definitely still not not enough to redeem having the MC's entire family brutally murdered by manipulating the MC for an entire year, though. What good is "he really did end up falling for them while undercover as a guard" if it still didn't hinder him from selling them out and leaving them to die?
I just played Damon's route in Ep 3 for the first time, after reading what you said and holy fuck, I feel sick. I tried the "You know you'd miss me" option and while I could easily imagine it as a defense mechanism from the MC before playing it, the fact that the game says the MC's enjoying this makes me sick to my stomach. I'd only played the friend route before, so I didn't truly understand. As you say, Damon's going to have to work his ass off trying to make up for that kind of fuckery.
(On a related note, I followed the link to your fic a few comments down and damn, dude, you wrote everything I could have wanted - put that bastard on his place if he thinks he can treat the MC like that)
Also!!! If you stay and listen instead of walking away, he mentions how Zovack wanted him for some long-term, boring assignment which ended up going to some red-haired dude!!! Damon literally would have done what Vexx did, if he hadn't thought it was too much of a bother!!! What the FUCK!!!
June's thing wasn't bad at all, not like Damon's or Vexx's. I completely understood where he was coming from, I did his scene at the strip club so I kinda already had the gist of his past and I even think he reacted pretty tamely (he... apologised several times in the same scene despite how angry he was? Not to be too biased, but he's literally an angel?). It hurt like shit, but it was the good kind of angst which comes from both sides having valid point of views, in my opinion. I even agree with him, in a sense. The MC might not have any blame, but as part of the royal family they still benefited directly from his suffering, even if it was unknowingly and unwillingly. I'm not saying he was right to yell at the MC when they just watched their entire world crash down and burn, but I get it. When I said he'd need a little redeeming, I meant more in the sense that he (and the MC, honestly) needs to heal, a lot, before he and the MC can move forward. Though I'm definitely, definitely biased ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Still wish the MC could have stormed out on him, though, but mostly because I'm self-projecting and as much as I use humor as a defense mechanism there's no way I'd be able to face him without crying lol
Now that would have been rough D: My MC's mother (the Tilaari Queen) is mentioned as cold and bitter, hating the King and hating life at the palace and seeing her children as nothing more than a duty. Which race did you play as,? This makes me want to replay the game with each race just to see how the Queens differ from each other.
Also, it's interesting that the youngest child would come from the first wife so I totally get the confusion! Mine was mentioned as being the third wife so I never gave it much thought. This makes me think the King probably enjoyed having all three wives for other reasons than just political ones, though... Kinda sickening if the first and second Queens felt as the third did.
I really like the idea of being able to choose who to talk to, it did feel like a bit much to get everyone's backstories one after another. Like you say, it does add a great deal of replayability value.
I hope we have the option to reject people as well, it would do for some solid roleplaying and replayability. It just might be a bit much to code, giving the MC an option to literally tell everyone to bite it and go off on their own for the rest (or at least some part) of the game.
About the Queen, I think the game mentions that there are 3 different Queens? So the 11 children would be divided among them. And I don't know which race you play as (I've been on the A6 Tumblr and remember them saying that each race has a different Queen as their mother) but my MC is Tilaari and her Queen/mother was mentioned as forced into a political marriage, hating it, and only seeing her children as a duty. So I think you're right with the silenced and oppressed part, probably for all three Queens.
Hey friend, thank you for sharing your thoughts as well. Hopefully it felt good to get it off your chest, and if nothing else then it made me happy (not happy, but you know what I mean) to know that I'm not alone in feeling this way either.
I completely understand the part about shutting off emotionally - I loved the scene with Bash (despite some of the comments saying they got whiplash from the tonal dissonance in it) because my main defense mechanism whenever emotions surface when I definitely don't want them to is to use humor. Even the romantic dialogue with Damon about "You know you'll miss me" felt very, very relatable (I didn't click on it yet so I don't know if I'll be correct) because it also feels like a joking tone and that is very much what I would use in that situation. Trying to detach myself as much as possible through cracking a joke, pretending I'm not affected. I get that people might not interpret it that way, but in my mind? The MC was definitely joking around as a defense mechanism.
That's a neat idea about Vexx! I see it working with what he said during his scene in that perhaps he tried saving the MC and Nerissa but wasn't able to, and then spent a lot of time trying to convince himself the MC was just another noble who definitely deserved it and god damn it he does not regret it he will NOT regret it. It'll still take a lot more to redeem him though, there's way too much damage to be cured by a simple "sorry your family is dead because of me, i feel terrible lol but hey i tried saving YOU right?"
And yeah, Damon definitely has a lot of growth to do if I'm going to like him again. He was my second fave but now? I might joke with you but good luck not getting punched in the dick if you want my MC anywhere near it, jackass.
I just replayed the scene when the MC returns to their quarters and sobs, and you're right. I still wish that wasn't all we got though, although I understand it as well. There isn't even a lock on the door, I would never feel comfortable enough to completely break down in there.
Maybe we're both self-projecting but hey, life is hard and sometimes you just need to project all your shit onto fictional characters. Thanks again for adding your thoughts!
Oh no, I totally get what you mean. I'm pretty forgiving but I cannot see any possible way for Vexx to make up for manipulating and using the MC for over a year, leading to the literal murder of their entire family (and the MC, if everything had gone to plan!!!). I'm really curious to see how they will try though because as much as I love redemption arcs, there's only so far a character can fall and still be redeemed. The writers will really have to build it up incredibly well for "poor" Vexx to have a chance.
Honestly the only way I see this working out happily for MC and Damon is guilt/regret on his part, which would take some major character development. In my eyes, he's irredeemable as well if he remains the way he is now. I like the idea of MC being cold and calculating but I don't think that's what the devs are going for, judging by what we've seen so far. Of course, fanfic writers should absolutely go wild with this lol I want to see the MC make Damon eat his own words :)
June is... complicated. He's my main RO so I'll be the first to admit that I'm biased, but I understand his reaction the most and was not at all surprised, in hindsight. I think he'll regret his treatment of the MC (including the he-didn't-say-it-out-loud-but-honestly-didn't-need-to thing) but he really needs to clear his head first. And I get the MC's reaction towards him as well - he's been so kind and so good and so patient and so understanding towards the MC from the moment they arrived. They mention several times how his eyes are warm and don't make them feel judged or anything but safe, and I can understand the MC wanting to cling to that when they've never received it before, just like they clung to Vexx at first when he revealed his betrayal. As I mentioned earlier, I am absolutely biased and probably self-projecting but my only wish regarding June's scene was the option to run away and cry lol
Again, this is all my opinion. One of the things I love the most in fiction is seeing characters realise their guilt and feel horrible about it (and break down in tears of regret holy shit that gets me going), so that's what would satisfy me the most. I totally get that it wouldn't be enough for most people, though.
I hope we can see the MC grow a damn spine in confidence as the story develops, though - a lot of what was said to them by the crew is very hard to get over and they shouldn't treat it like nothing. The MC might have self-esteem issues and even some sort of mental illness but that shouldn't remain their permanent state - I want to see the MC stand up for themself as they heal.
Sorry for the long reply haha, turns out I have a LOT of thoughts and feelings about this game.
The crew: OuR CLotHeS aRE piNK
My Tilaari MC with pastel pink skin, red hair and red eyes: omg we're matching <3
The crew:
June: sure, dear
In all seriousness this was a super cute DLC and I was either cackling or going 'awwww' at all times!
Pro tip to anyone who found this game after Ep 3 was already released like I did, though: do NOT wait to play this until you're finished with Ep 3, trust me on that one :(
Let me just say, I found this game yesterday and played the whole thing all the way through (including the Valentine's DLC) and holy shit dudes this one is my favourite VN I've played yet. Thank you so much for the work you're doing and I hope you can all listen to the comments because they stem from our love for this game!
Now, onto episode 3...
(TL;DR - from a POV of mental illness, MC is relatable af)
I get what everyone is saying about the MC being weak and how they shouldn't have taken everything lying down (haven't done Damon's romanced dialogue yet but his friendship dialogue was... enough) but honestly? I kinda get the MC's reaction.
Might just be self-projection but I don't feel MC's reaction is strange at all. They've just remembered their past of being unwanted and uncared for, including by her own family. They're remembering how they literally didn't matter in the grand scheme of things - as the eleventh child of the king, they were never important enough to even be seen by the general populace . Whenever they sneaked out, all they heard about their family (and by extension, themself) is how evil they are and how everyone hates them. The only two people who ever smiled at them are either brutally murdered or the one who made sure it happened by using the MC.
My mental health is already unstable and I haven't gone through anything even remotely like that. What sense of self-worth would the MC have after such an upbringing and everything that they've learned in the past few hours? If it was me, I'd probably be in a deep, deep hole of feeling like I deserve everything the crew is throwing at me. I might even have agreed with Damon. Everything would be just another brick on the tower of self-hatred the MC must have built by now, unless their mind is exceptionally strong.
There's also the matter about the comments mentioning shock and PTSD, which are also completely valid ways to interpret it.
This is all personal interpretation, of course, and I absolutely wish we could have lashed out in some way. I wish we could have told Damon to fuck off, and I wish we could have stormed out on June. But most of all, I wish the MC had the option to break down crying.
On another note - the situation with Vexx was absolutely horrible in the most delicious way possible (I'm an angst hoe all the way) and I am very curious to see how the writers could possibly redeem him, because as things are now there's no way I can see that happening. They'll have trouble enough with Damon and probably June - Vexx will be nigh impossible.
Edit: Added a TL;DR and corrected some grammar
