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(1 edit) (-2)

I'm not convinced by the argument that you should save heart scrolls because they're "worth more" later in the game. Levelling is also "worth more" later in the game! In my experience, if you use a scroll earlier, you'll have more XP for levelling later, and in the end game it all comes out in the wash.

You should save heart scrolls because:

1. You can use a heart scroll at any time, but you can only level if you have enough XP. You can get stuck with not enough XP and either no hearts available to get more or no safe moves available to get more.

2. Using a heart scroll makes you repeat the current heart level. This can be damaging early in the game, when you have a much more limited set of safe moves available, they don't always open up more safe moves, and using up more of them without progressing towards being able to take out bigger monsters (especially the mine king) can hurt you.

The time to think about this is not when you have no choice but to use a heart scroll, but when you are considering possible monster combinations earlier -- it's usually better to fill your XP and level than to risk not filling it and falling short. Especially if you're trying to get the rat stamp, which makes exploration very risky, and makes eliminating known monsters until you find the rat king a lot safer.

(+3)

So, to refute that point, first let's establish that, with the exception of walls, every time you spend life, you gain that much experience. Sometimes you can get experience for free, and walls are a loss on return and should always be broken last, anyway. In all other cases, you spend your HP, and if you don't die, you get that much in EXP back. Let's also understand that there is a max HP, but there is no max EXP, you can pool it as much as you want.

At the start of the game, you have 5 HP, and you need 4 EXP to level up. You spend your 5 life, and you now have 5 EXP. You now have the choice to either level up or to use a heal scroll. In the first case, your health refills back up to 5 (with half a heart towards a max of 6 next level!) and you have 1 EXP banked towards reaching the new limit of 5 EXP. If you use a health scroll, you refill your 5 hearts right away, and keep your 5 banked EXP.

Here's the crux of the matter. No matter which scenario you pick, you still have to spend 4 EXP to level up. You're not saving it for later, you STILL have to spend that 4 EXP, you're just delaying when you spend it. However, since there is a direct relationship between HP and EXP, you have assigned that scroll a worth of 5 EXP while using it while your max HP is only 5 hearts. If you waited until you had, say, 7 hearts or 10 hearts or even more, that is how much EXP that scroll would be worth. By using it early, you miss out on the potential for that scroll to be even more valuable. Meanwhile, the experience you gain by spending your health down as normal is experience you will gain one way or the other, and it will be spent on leveling up one way or the other. Scrolls are always worth more the longer you hold off of using them.

That said, unless you're aiming for something in specific, you don't have to be perfectly 100% optimal to win. It helps your odds, for sure, but if you would rather use a scroll for safety than take a gamble on something you're unsure on, its better to keep the run going than not.

Deleted 293 days ago
(-1)

OK, after a bunch of paper and pencil calculations I remembered that the game has a debug mode. :) I compared a couple of strategies for using the scrolls (various numbers of scrolls and different bonuses ignored or not), and I can see now how the maths works.

The lower early value of the scrolls is partially offset by the lower amount of XP needed to level at the early stages, which makes the penalty less noticeable in a typical game, but in extreme cases (all available scrolls spent before any levelling) the constant low value of the scrolls plus the additional HP gained and spent during levelling is not enough to match the increasing XP cost of levelling. That was the missing link for me.

How do you access debug mode in the current version? Used to be you could just hit D, but that was removed.

(+1)

Shift+D

Bless, this is very useful for testing things, thank you