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A jam submission

HoplomachosView project page

Duelling hoplites
Submitted by RTokarczuk — 96 days, 12 hours before the deadline
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Hoplomachos's itch.io page

Results

CriteriaRankScore*Raw Score
Playability - Mechanics#84.0004.000
Theme#94.6674.667

Ranked from 3 ratings. Score is adjusted from raw score by the median number of ratings per game in the jam.

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Comments

Submitted (1 edit)

Played this with my fellow Pista's designer and really enjoyed it. We took some notes as we played that you might find helpful:

Rules comments 

  1. Shield bash: it was unclear that shield bash uses the same move card and doesn't fully complete the procedure for Step 2. An edit like this could help clarify: "use this card to resolve an additional Attack like during Step B." We also assumed that this was an "additional" attack on top of Step 2 attack.
  2. Attack: "If defender cannot" led to questions as it can be interpreted as "cannot play cards." Realize in context that it means "cannot flip", but figured it was worth pointing out. 
  3. Wound: From the very useful video, we're assuming the multiple cards = multiple wounds. . If this is the case maybe something like "receives 1 wound for every card used to successful Attack." There's also a minor typo: "is receives 1 wound." 
  4. Continuation: It's unclear who's trump suit counts. ""in the trump suit" needs a little more precision.  

General feedback

The game shows smart restraint and cleverly embraces the postcard design restrictions. Our only real issue was game length, which with learning time took us almost two hours to complete. I'm assuming this shortens significantly with each play, but it seems too long. The presentation and lightweight rules give off the impression that a match will last about 30 minutes—perfect for playing a best 2 out of 3. Barring misplays, the prolonged length likely has to do with how the game incentivizes retreating (assuming you can move backwards) and continuation (this could maybe use more risk as it became central to our strategies and only done when we were 99% we'd win and not waste a card). While we appreciate the depth these tactics provide and are not suggesting removing them, it did result in us stalling the game to a near halt. And while the daze mechanic is a very clever merger of theme and mechanics, it did create a daze spiral at the end of the game that felt more like dead turns than the fatigue from a grueling battle. 

Length aside, Hoplomachus's equipment, fatigue system, trump selection, and balanced card play all come together to elegantly abstract the topic. The card tactics, feints, the opportunity for bluffs, and the longer term planning the continuation mechanic (my personal favorite) encourages really emulate the feeling of a tough and tense duel.

DeveloperSubmitted

Thanks for the feedback!

I can use it to improve the rules/ phrasing, to clarify the uncertainties and correct the faulty phrasings. The new version of the postcard should be uploaded before the end of this week.

What exactly were the players doing that the game took 120 minutes? In my "internal testing" (showing the game to myself and also three other people that are not me :) ), this has never occurred. I am guessing that players made an attack - maybe with a shield bash, maybe not, and then moved 'backwards' to rest and reduce the fatigue. In short, I think that in your game players were making different decisions than it did happen in the games that I've seen. (This is not a complaint, just a public realization that this design never received more intensive, "external" testing). 

My meager tests always ended with one side receiving the second hit before drawing the very last card of a deck. Sometimes the game was even over before the first "reshuffle". My idea was that if the one player plays aggressively, they may end up overwhelming the other... or be rebuffed and effectively countered (and KO'd). From Your description, if the principle behind the player's decisions were to be sure (99% and more) of success, then yes - the game lasts longer.

Thank You for Your interest and time dedicated to the game!

Submitted (1 edit)

Oh man, we must have been misplaying something if 120 mins is such an anomaly! Either that or there was a series of turns where we were both playing "passively", i.e. taking several back to back turns to rest, slowing progress to a wound. We'll give it another careful go and see if we get a different outcome. 

DeveloperSubmitted

I was wondering whether that 120 minutes included reading the rules and watching the YT video... but then again, it can be different when the players learn the game by themselves, when the designer is not "behind Your shoulder" etc. It may be also a sign that my rules are not clear or that they convey the wrong message.

In Your game, did You exhaust the draw pile (and all the reshuffles, as well)? I don't think that I have stated this in the rules explicitly... but my intention was that at some point, the players will run out of the cards to play... and after the last reshuffle (adding the "last face cards") - the cards that are played/ discarded are out.

I may need to add to the rules a remark that if all cards are 'used up''/ if the last card is used up, the game is over, probably in a sort of a tie.

Submitted

We took about 30 minutes learning and got distracted in conversation, so I'm guessing we were really closer to around 60-90 minutes playtime. Next play we'll pay particular attention to any rules that misplaying could cause the game to go on longer. We discussed it some more and think maybe we played too conservatively and used rest several turns in a row to essentially reset the game. 

For draw piles, we shuffled the last deck and went through a decent portion of the deck, but the game ended before we drew the final final card. We were close, so I could imagine a rare match where the game would need to account for exhausting all cards.